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TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS FOR THE CANADIAN RADIO-TELEVISION AND TELECOMMUNICATIONS COMMISSION TRANSCRIPTION DES AUDIENCES DU CONSEIL DE LA RADIODIFFUSION ET DES TÉLÉCOMMUNICATIONS CANADIENNES SUBJECT / SUJET: PUBLIC HEARING ON THIRD LANGUAGE AND ETHNIC PROGRAMMING / AUDIENCE PUBLIQUE SUR LA PROGRAMMATION MULTILINGUE ET À CARACTÈRE ETHNIQUE HELD AT: TENUE À: Dunsmuir Seniors Centre Dunsmuir Seniors Centre 411 Dunsmuir Street 411 Dunsmuir Street Vancouver, B.C. Vancouver (C.-B.) February 1, 1999 Le 1er février 1999 Volume 1 tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668 Transcripts In order to meet the requirements of the Official Languages Act, transcripts of proceedings before the Commission will be bilingual as to their covers, the listing of the CRTC members and staff attending the public hearings, and the Table of Contents. However, the aforementioned publication is the recorded verbatim transcript and, as such, is taped and transcribed in either of the official languages, depending on the language spoken by the participant at the public hearing. Transcription Afin de rencontrer les exigences de la Loi sur les langues officielles, les procès-verbaux pour le Conseil seront bilingues en ce qui a trait à la page couverture, la liste des membres et du personnel du CRTC participant à l'audience publique ainsi que la table des matières. Toutefois, la publication susmentionnée est un compte rendu textuel des délibérations et, en tant que tel, est enregistrée et transcrite dans l'une ou l'autre des deux langues officielles, compte tenu de la langue utilisée par le participant à l'audience publique. tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668 Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission Conseil de la radiodiffusion et des télécommunications canadiennes Transcript / Transcription Public Hearing / Audience publique Third Language and Ethnic Programming / Programmation multilingue et à caractère ethnique BEFORE/DEVANT: C. Grauer Chairperson / Présidente A. Cardozo Commissioner / Conseiller ALSO PRESENT / AUSSI PRÉSENTS: M. Vogel Secretary / Secrétaire D. Jones Legal Counsel/Conseillers G. Batstone juridiques Volume 1 tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668 ii TABLE OF CONTENTS / TABLE DES MATIÈRES PAGE Presentation by / Présentation par: Rogers Cablesystems Limited 5 Canadian-Hispanic Congress 14 Calvin Koat 18 Valerie Dare 27 Affiliation of Multicultural Societies 31 and Service Agencies O.K. Radio Group 42 The Cambodian Community in Vancouver 50 Hardeep Dhaliwal 56 Rogers Multicultural Service (Iranian Program) 60 Anup Singh Jubbal 66 SUCCESS (United Chinese Community Enrichment 71 Services Society) YWCA 79 Wendy Au 88 Mason Loh 97 The Agape Christian Team of Canada 105 Community Advisory Council for 109 South Asian Productions Fairchild Media Group 114 The Vancouver and Lower Mainland Multicultural 122 Family Support Services Meena and Anand Paranjpe 127 Civil Youth Strategy Group 135 David Ali 144 Nancy Li 144 tel: 613-521-0703 StenoTran fax: 613-521-7668 1 1 Vancouver, B.C. / Vancouver (C.-B.) 2 --- Upon commencing on Monday, February 1, 1999 3 at 1603 / L'audience débute le lundi 1er février 4 1999 à 1603 5 1 THE CHAIRPERSON: Good evening, 6 ladies and gentlemen. Welcome to this series of public 7 consultations the CRTC is holding to review its ethnic 8 broadcasting. I am Cindy Grauer and allow me to 9 introduce my colleague Andrew Cardozo. We are both 10 CRTC Commissioners. 11 2 For the next three days, today, 12 tomorrow and Wednesday, my Commission colleagues and I 13 will be listening to the comments and views presented 14 by the participants in these consultations, here in 15 Vancouver, as well as in Montreal, Halifax, Toronto, 16 and Winnipeg. We will also be receiving written 17 comments and documents by e-mail. All submissions, 18 both oral and written, will form part of the public 19 record. 20 Objective of the consultations 21 3 These consultations are part of a 22 process the CRTC began two years ago to review its 23 major policies for the Canadian broadcasting system, 24 including television and radio. 25 4 The goal of these consultations is to StenoTran 2 1 help the CRTC examine the policies and regulations that 2 were established in 1985 when a Broadcasting Policy 3 Reflecting Canada's Cultural and Linguistic Diversity 4 was issued. One of the most important goals of this 5 policy is to ensure that the Canadian broadcasting 6 system serves the needs and interests of all Canadians 7 by reflecting their ethnocultural diversity in an 8 effective manner. 9 5 However, since this policy was 10 issued, Canada's demographic profile has changed 11 considerably, and the amount of third language and 12 ethnic programming available in the Canadian 13 broadcasting system has increased substantially. 14 6 By looking into these issues around 15 ethnic broadcasting, we are asking: are the goals of 16 the current policy still valid? And, is the policy 17 still effective in attaining these goals? 18 7 Public Notice 1998-135 set out a 19 series of questions and invited your views in response. 20 We are ready to hear your comments. But, before we do, 21 allow me to go on to some housekeeping matters 22 regarding the conduct of this consultation. 23 Housekeeping matters 24 8 CRTC staff assisting us during this 25 consultation are Geoff Batstone, Dylan Jones and StenoTran 3 1 Marguerite Vogel, who is Director of our Western and 2 Territories Regional Office, she will be our secretary. 3 I invite you to call on them with any questions you may 4 have, including any questions about the process today, 5 and for the rest of the proceeding. 6 9 Our intention is to have the session 7 run until all participants have been heard. The 8 secretary will call each presenter in order. If you 9 want to make a presentation, but have not registered in 10 advance, please let the secretary know. Time 11 permitting, we will try to fit you into the schedule. 12 10 I also want to add here that in the 13 interest of ensuring that we hear from all of you and 14 hear fully your comments, we will not be asking 15 questions unless we have important questions of 16 clarification. And I think it's important, we want to 17 stress to you that doesn't reflect a lack of interest 18 on our part, but rather a desire to ensure that we hear 19 from you at these consultations. 20 11 To ensure that all parties have an 21 opportunity to make a presentation, we ask that you 22 limit your comments to ten minutes. 23 12 The proceedings will be transcribed 24 and the transcript will form part of the record upon 25 which the Commission makes its decision. So that the StenoTran 4 1 people responsible for this task can provide an 2 accurate record, I would ask that, when you speak, you 3 press the small red button on the microphone in front 4 of you. This activates the microphone, and is 5 indicated by a red light. 6 13 For those of you who prefer to submit 7 your comments in writing, comment cards are available 8 at the back of the room, and from the secretary. If 9 you have any comments you would like to pass on, just 10 write them on a card, sign it and give it to the 11 secretary before the end of the session. 12 14 I'd also like to add that anyone can 13 file any written submissions or comments with the 14 Commission until March 4th, I believe that's the 15 outside deadline for submissions. 16 15 We also will, perhaps, take a short 17 five minute break in about an hour and a half, and then 18 maybe a half an hour dinner break around 6:30. We'll 19 really judge how we're doing with the time and how 20 we're moving through the presenters when we have these 21 breaks. 22 16 Now, Madame Secretary, if we can call 23 the first presenter. 24 17 THE SECRETARY: Thank you, 25 Commissioner Grauer. StenoTran 5 1 18 A word, first, of how we're planning 2 to schedule the presenters. We would like as many 3 people as there are microphones to be around the table 4 at the same time. So with that in mind, I will call 5 names, and this is, of course, in order to cut down on 6 commute time, because we'll have about ten people 7 around the table. All ten people will present and when 8 they are finished, then they can make room for the next 9 group of ten. 10 19 So I would just like to confirm that 11 the following people are around the table. We have 12 Vera Piccini, Collette Watson, Rosanna Obando, Ignatio 13 Ponce de Lion, Calvin Koat, Valerie Dare, Vera Radyo -- 14 is Anup Singh Jubbal here? -- Stuart Morton, Diana 15 Parker and Brian Blackburn, Phangsy Nou -- is Lilian To 16 in the room? Not yet, okay -- Hardeep Dhaliwal, would 17 you like to come up with this group? Thank you very 18 much. 19 20 And I think that takes care of the 20 number of microphones that we have available. Thank 21 you very much. 22 21 I would now invite Vera Piccini to 23 make her presentation. 24 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 25 22 MS PICCINI: Thank you. My name is StenoTran 6 1 Vera Piccini and I am the Acting Vice President and 2 General Manager for Rogers Cablesystems in B.C. With 3 me today is Collette Watson, the national Vice 4 President of Programming and Public Relations for 5 Rogers Cablesystems. 6 23 First of all, let me say how much we 7 appreciate the opportunity provided by these public 8 consultations and the honour of going first. The issue 9 of ethnic broadcasting is one that is very close to our 10 hearts and one in which Rogers Cablesystems has a great 11 deal of experience. While we don't have time today to 12 cover many of the issues and questions raised in the 13 Public Notice, we will be filing detailed comments in 14 the second phase of this proceeding. Our sister 15 company, Rogers Broadcasting, the licensee of CFMT-TV 16 Toronto, Canada's only multilingual television 17 broadcasting station, will be appearing in Toronto 18 later this week, and will address a number of issues 19 relevant to the broadcasting side of Rogers operations. 20 24 Today, we, as Rogers Cable, want to 21 focus on three key areas. One, our experience, as a 22 cable company, in satisfying the needs of ethnocultural 23 audiences on a local level; two, our track record in 24 offering ethnic programming services on a national 25 level; and, three, the role of ethnic programming StenoTran 7 1 services in a digital world. 2 25 Satisfying Local Needs; Rogers 3 Multicultural Channel. 4 26 Probably everyone in this room is 5 familiar with the Rogers Multicultural Channel. It has 6 been a Lower Mainland institution for twenty years, 7 currently available to over 620,000 customers. When we 8 started in 1979, we had access to only part of a 9 channel, sharing space with other programming and 10 scheduling our multicultural programs solely in the 11 evenings. Today, we are on the air 16 and a half hours 12 a day, offering quality international entertainment, 13 news, drama and sports programs from around the world. 14 27 Normally, I would hesitate to read 15 into the record a long list, but I do believe it is 16 worth making an exception in the case of the nearly 30 17 languages which make up our multicultural channel. 18 This list demonstrates the breadth and diversity of the 19 Rogers Multicultural B.C. audience. Last fall's 20 schedule -- highly representative of the Canadian 21 mosaic -- included the following languages: 22 28 Armenian, Cantonese, Danish, Dari, 23 English, Farsi, Finnish, German, Hindi, Hindustani, 24 Hungarian, Italian, Japanese, Korea, Mandarin, 25 Norwegian, Pashto, Polish, Portugese, Punjabi, StenoTran 8 1 Romanian, Serbian, Spanish, Swedish, Pilipino, and 2 Urdu. 3 29 The Rogers Multicultural Channel 4 programming is cosmopolitan -- as are our viewers. The 5 programming schedule is a mix of the linguistic and 6 cross-cultural programs reflecting the diversity of 7 language and culture in the Lower Mainland. As an 8 example, there's children's programming, such as the 9 Korean puppet show "Once upon a Time"; highly-rated 10 international variety entertainment such as the popular 11 series from the Philippines, "Eezy Dancing", and music 12 shows from Italy, India, Latin America and Iran. 13 30 Interestingly, a small percentage of 14 our audience speaks only English, yet enjoys watching 15 our multilingual programming for a variety of reasons. 16 Some of these viewers have a spouse with a different 17 cultural background, others are in language classes for 18 personal or business reasons and wish to practice their 19 skills at comprehension, and still others view it as 20 armchair travel to distant countries. 21 31 We stay in touch with our viewers' 22 needs through the Rogers Multicultural Response Line 23 which is a 24-hour-a-day voice-mail service. This 24 gives us a clearer window on our viewers' opinions, 25 their likes and their dislikes, and their suggestions StenoTran 9 1 for programming on the channel. For example, our 2 recent move to include more programming with English 3 sub-titles was a direct response to viewer feedback. 4 32 A multicultural channel such as ours 5 achieves three key objectives. One, links viewers to 6 their origin nations; two, promotes cross-cultural 7 understanding; and, three, strengthens and unites an 8 ethnocultural community. 9 33 But this doesn't mean that we can be 10 all things to all people -- nor does it mean that we 11 should be the only game in town. We are neither an 12 access channel nor a community television station... 13 and we are certainly not a commercial multilingual 14 station. We are a special programming service that 15 endeavours, with limited resources, to reach our 16 viewers through a mix of linguistic and cross-cultural 17 programs. 18 34 We know there is an audience in the 19 Lower Mainland for more ethnocultural programming. We 20 believe that the time and the demographics are right 21 for the licensing of another station in this market, 22 one which would have the deeper pockets necessary to 23 provide more extensive, high quality Canadian 24 programming in languages other than English and French. 25 This is an expensive proposition and beyond the StenoTran 10 1 financial means of a channel such as ours. We would 2 not consider a commercial, local, multilingual station 3 to be a competitor. We could never hope to achieve the 4 level of Canadian content that such a broadcaster would 5 be required to carry. And many of the producers who 6 have contributed to our success over the years would 7 welcome the opportunities that such a television 8 station would bring to the Vancouver area. 9 35 Collette...? 10 36 Community Television Programming. 11 37 MS WATSON: This year both the CRTC 12 and Rogers Community Television stations celebrate 13 their 30th anniversaries. One of the cornerstones of 14 community television is its ability to reflect Canada's 15 ethnocultural diversity in an effective way. This 16 valued contribution that Canadian cable operators make 17 to the Canadian broadcasting system fulfils a vital 18 niche in our markets. For our part, by providing 19 access to facilities, training and staff, Rogers 20 community stations are able to encourage the production 21 of locally relevant multicultural programming in many 22 of our systems. 23 38 In B.C., the Community Channel 24 provides approximately one and a half hours of 25 multicultural programming per week, and ranges from StenoTran 11 1 discussion of cross-cultural issues, to local events 2 and celebrations. For example, "Cross Cultural", a 3 half hour weekly program, covers a variety of 4 multicultural topics in the community mostly done in 5 English. 6 39 In Ottawa, there are 23 diverse 7 ethnic groups who produce mother tongue programs on 8 each of the English and French community channels. In 9 addition, the Italian community has a weekly one hour 10 time slot on the English community channel. 11 40 In Toronto, "Diverse City" is a 12 lighter exploration of cross-cultural issues in 13 Toronto. In addition, 16 different ethnic groups 14 produce mother tongue programming for the weekly 15 multicultural time block on this community channel. 16 2. Ethnic Programming Services on a Regional and 17 National Level 18 41 In the spring of 1996, the Commission 19 outlined its policy dealing with the issues of access 20 by Canadian programming services to broadcast 21 distribution undertakings. The guiding principle of 22 this policy was that broadcast distributors must give 23 priority to the distribution of services of licensed 24 Canadian programming undertakings appropriate for their 25 specific markets. This includes ethnic programming StenoTran 12 1 services where the distributor is operating in a market 2 in which 10 percent or more of the total population is 3 of one of the ethnic origins to which the service is 4 intended to appeal. 5 42 Rogers strongly believes in the role 6 of specialized ethnic programming services in the 7 Canadian broadcasting system. Currently we carry 8 Telelatino in all our systems in the Greater Toronto 9 Area and Southwest Ontario. We are offering Fairchild 10 in Toronto/Peel and Etobicoke -- even though the target 11 audience is significantly less than 10 percent of the 12 population -- and we carry it here in most of our 13 systems in British Columbia. We also carry 14 Talentvision in the majority of our B.C. systems. 15 43 While we would like to be able to 16 offer every programming service that is authorized for 17 carriage in our markets, we are currently constrained 18 by limited analog channel capacity. We are making 19 significant ongoing investments to meet our customers' 20 expectations for more choice and better service. And 21 we are introducing our digital offering this year, 22 which will significantly expand our channel capacity 23 and programming choice. 24 44 Vera...? 25 3. Ethnic Programming Services in a Digital World StenoTran 13 1 45 MS PICCINI: Rogers Cable believes 2 that the expanded channel capacity resulting from 3 digitization should allow the introduction of 4 additional foreign ethnic specialty services. To this 5 end, we would urge the Commission to remove the 6 moratorium on the addition of any new foreign ethnic 7 services to the Lists of Eligible Satellite Services 8 from digital distribution only. There are a number of 9 attractive programming services which, if added to the 10 digital programming line-up, would have the dual 11 benefit of helping to drive the penetration of digital, 12 as well as contributing to programming diversity in 13 this country. 14 46 In closing, to celebrate the 20th 15 anniversary of the Rogers Multicultural Channel, we are 16 proud to be relaunching the channel with a new look and 17 a new format as part of Multiculturalism Week 18 activities which begin on February the 14th in British 19 Columbia. 20 47 Thank you, and we would be pleased to 21 answer any questions. 22 48 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 23 much, Ms Piccini. We don't have any questions for you 24 today. 25 49 Thank you. StenoTran 14 1 50 THE SECRETARY: I would now invite 2 Rosanna Obando and Ignatio Ponce de Lion to make their 3 presentation. 4 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 5 51 MS OBANDO: Rosanna Obando et nos 6 sécretaire aux des Canadiennes-Hispanic Congress. 7 52 Basically, there are several reasons 8 why should be a third language and ethnocultural 9 production on the air. Primarily, as a consideration 10 to reflect Canada's linguistic and ethnocultural 11 diversity. Hispanics in Vancouver often say, "We like 12 Canada and we are glad to have the richness of this 13 country, but we are still to have fulfil our needs, 14 too". That is we need to nurture and promote our 15 values, traditions and heritage without forgetting that 16 the Spanish is our mother tongue and is part of our own 17 lives and realities in Canada. 18 53 Hispanics are active and positive 19 people. More than 20 Spanish speaking countries. 20 Hispanic men and women often express interest in each 21 other for the art, education, jobs, entertainment, 22 sports events and we also share these with Canadians 23 alike at large. 24 54 According to the National Census in 25 1996, the top ten languages in Canada after the English StenoTran 15 1 and French in order of importance are: Chinese, 2 Italian, German, Spanish, Polish, Punjabi, 3 Pargolote (ph), Vietnamese, and Korean. 4 55 The third language and ethnic 5 production is an issue that should have primary 6 consideration to reflect Canada's linguistic and 7 cultural diversity. Again, more than 50 of the 8 Canadian population is of an origin which is not 9 English or French, and this reflects the demographic 10 profile of our country. 11 56 Conventional television requires a 12 large viewing audience in order to secure the financial 13 support of advertisers. The satisfaction is placed 14 from values in the cultural communities has strongly 15 proclaimed the need for a multicultural content. 16 57 New hard-take media is important, 17 too. There are still audiences who are not satisfied 18 with the information provided through conventional 19 programming on television in their third language, are 20 turning to the Internet for information. Their rigid 21 framing of programming is forcing customers to switch 22 to a third language at the live services, thus losing 23 audiences. 24 58 Third language communities have 25 considerable and have today creative broadcasting StenoTran 16 1 material to supply to mainstream channels. The global 2 economy includes a worldwide exchange of ethnic 3 communities who are using the information for the 4 television as the media of communication. But, at the 5 same time, they are losing the right to use the media 6 on television on their own language. Ethnic 7 communities require a specific and useful information 8 in their third language to meet their basic needs. 9 Ethnic communities more claim a huge amount of 10 information as soon they arrives in Canada. Television 11 is a valuable contribution to the needs of immigrants 12 for learning the English language, as well as a means 13 to cope with the cultural shock after leaving their 14 countries. 15 59 The main purpose of having a third 16 language channel is to become involved and allow for 17 the involvement of the mainstream community, but 18 promoting more activities role through the development 19 and implementation of educative programs. 20 60 Canadian broadcasters should follow 21 the new Broadcasting Act which came into force on June 22 4, 1991, in which the Commission was given the 23 additional responsibility of ensuring that the 24 industry, through its programs and employment 25 opportunity arising out its operations reflect the StenoTran 17 1 specific characteristics of Canadian society. 2 61 Thank you very much. Now, another 3 member of the Congress. 4 62 MR. PONCE DE LION: Good afternoon 5 Members of the CRTC. 6 63 I would like to thank you, first, for 7 the opportunity that your Commission is giving us. We 8 came this afternoon to review the 1985 policy on third 9 language and ethnic broadcasting in Canada. 10 64 Your communication of December the 11 10th inviting the different ethnic communities today 12 reinforces the fact that these communities have grown 13 over the past few years, that their demographic profile 14 has changed and their needs to be informed increased 15 and the capacity of keeping everyone informed has 16 decreased and is limited. 17 65 That's why the ethnic communities in 18 Canada should have their own way to inform each new 19 members of their communities in their own language and 20 in their own ethnic multicultural broadcasting 21 programming. 22 66 We are not here today looking for a 23 space in the media to reinforce our culture in Canada; 24 we are here today because our communities need to share 25 a space that is going to provide enough accurate StenoTran 18 1 information as fast as possible to the new landed 2 immigrants to help them integrate -- to help integrate 3 them and their families into society, avoiding extra 4 cost to the system. 5 67 As a member of the 1999 6 Canadian-Hispanic Congress Branch of B.C. and as a 7 landed immigrant of this country and on behalf of each 8 community, I wish to thank you for your consideration 9 and for the opportunity to come before you today. We 10 look forward to all communities working together, 11 meeting our goals. 12 68 Thank you. 13 69 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 14 much, Ms Obando and Mr. Ponce de Lion. 15 70 THE SECRETARY: I now invite Calvin 16 Koat to make his presentation. 17 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 18 71 MR. KOAT: Just to start, I'd like to 19 say that on the itinerary, it should read "Contemporary 20 Multicultural Radio and Type 'E' Programming: The 21 Future of the Format". I think a long title like that, 22 we kind of ran out of room, so... 23 72 Madame and Monsieur Commissions, 24 broadcast colleagues and members of the public, my name 25 is Cal Koat. I'm a 20 year veteran of broadcasting in StenoTran 19 1 Greater Vancouver with over 12 years experience in 2 multicultural radio where my work continues at the 3 present time. But this evening, I'm addressing you as 4 a private individual with a deep and abiding interest 5 in this very special form of radio broadcasting. 6 1630 7 73 It's encouraging to me that the CRTC 8 has organized this review in such timely fashion, for I 9 believe that multicultural radio has arrived at a 10 crossroads and it must re-examine and restructure its 11 role, in light of society's changing needs, if this 12 format is to survive and flourish in the next century. 13 74 AM 1470, CJVB, Vancouver's premier 14 multicultural radio station, launched in 1972 and I 15 listened vicariously through my parents who, like many 16 northern European immigrants, tuned in for 17 variety-style programming in their native tongue. 18 Today, the first generation of listeners to 19 multicultural radio are fading away and the second 20 generation, my generation, has become largely 21 assimilated into our Canadian culture, consumers of 22 mainstream media. Personally, however, I can attest to 23 a sense of cultural identity and pride which could 24 still be touched by multicultural radio if it were 25 targeted appropriately. StenoTran 20 1 75 First and second generation 2 immigrants remain the primary audience groups for 3 multicultural radio, but as the vision of a global 4 village becomes realized through new technology and as 5 the mosaic of our multicultural society becomes more 6 diverse, there is an increasing thirst, among the 7 general populace, for a better understanding of 8 different cultures and an appreciation for their 9 artistic expressions. This is probably what has lead 10 to the current phenomenon in music called "World Music" 11 or "Worldbeat", the fastest growing musical genre in 12 the market. 13 76 Consumers of "World Music" feel 14 disenfranchised by the proliferation of "Adult 15 Contemporary" and "Hit" radio stations and seek an 16 alternative which appeals to their global 17 sensibilities. These individuals represent a new 18 audience segment for multicultural radio and lend 19 direction to ethnic radio broadcasters for the future 20 of the format. 21 77 Keeping in mind the needs of these 22 three segments of society, which make up today's 23 multicultural radio audience, I'd like to identify what 24 I see to be the challenges facing Canada's ethnic 25 broadcasters. StenoTran 21 1 78 When your business is diversity, 2 consistency becomes your greatest challenge. Listeners 3 what the convenience of hearing their kind of 4 programming at the times they tune in the radio. 5 Advertisers in a competitive market require the 6 confidence of long time blocks of guaranteed 7 listenership in which to place their commercials. 8 79 Ethnic radio broadcasters licensed to 9 serve a particularly high number of cultural 10 communities -- some with commitments of more than 20 in 11 their condition of licence -- have great difficulty in 12 generating longer listening blocks. Out of 20 or more 13 communities served, an ethnic broadcaster may identify 14 only one or two which have a large enough population 15 base and an economic vibrancy to attract corporate 16 advertisers and show potential for profit. 17 80 Obviously, the broadcaster will 18 devote the bulk of his sales, marketing and promotional 19 resources toward the development of programming for 20 these communities. The remaining majority of cultural 21 programs must either be subsidized by the profitable 22 programming or maintained through brokerage agreements. 23 81 Brokerages create their own 24 challenges. Since brokers purchase airtime from the 25 licensee, outside of adhering to the codes all StenoTran 22 1 commercial broadcasters are subject to, they may assume 2 autonomy over their broadcasting time period. This 3 makes it difficult for station programmers to 4 coordinate brokered programs with the rest of the 5 broadcast schedule. Further, if mainstream advertisers 6 are uninterested in this brokered program, the 7 potential for station-generated revenues in that time 8 block is capped at the brokered rate for the airtime 9 alone. 10 82 In order for the brokers themselves 11 to be successful, they must be certain of sustaining 12 advertising revenues from within their target community 13 to cover the costs of airtime. Without this cash flow, 14 the broker can quickly fall into a cycle of mounting 15 debt to the licensee and eventually have to back ut of 16 the agreement. Ultimately, it's another cultural 17 community which suffers the loss of radio service. 18 83 The remaining majority of subsidized 19 programs on the weekly schedule have little opportunity 20 to become profitable, through no fault of the licensee. 21 Since sales, marketing and promotional resources are 22 being necessarily funnelled into the profit-making 23 shows, subsidized programs are maintained with a 24 minimal amount of effort and occupy as little time as 25 possible on the schedule. The producers of these StenoTran 23 1 programs -- many of which are volunteers -- can become 2 easily disillusioned by the lack of support for their 3 efforts and simply walk away from their shows, leaving 4 a hole in the station's schedule, and leaving the 5 licensee scrambling to find an appropriate 6 substitution. 7 84 Today's multicultural radio 8 programming grid has become a very inconsistent, 9 tenuous patchwork of programs with little opportunity 10 for sustained listenership. I believe, in order to 11 stabilize and improve this situation, the Commission 12 needs to re-evaluate its policy concerning the five 13 types of ethnic programming and allow licensees the 14 freedom to effectively arrange their broadcast 15 schedules. 16 85 And rather than maintaining an 17 ever-changing and growing number of pockets of specific 18 third language programs to less profitable, smaller 19 communities, ethnic broadcasters should be allowed to 20 develop a broader, more consistent service, inclusive 21 of all cultural communities. This could be achieved if 22 Type E programming were counted toward their minimum 23 weekly requirement of ethnic programs in their 24 Condition of License. 25 86 Utilizing music as the international StenoTran 24 1 language, Type E programming can touch first generation 2 immigrants, the second and subsequent generations, as 3 well as disenfranchised mainstream listeners seeking a 4 contemporary radio alternative. Type E programming 5 opens up ethnic radio to a much broader listener base 6 and encourages sustained listenership through 7 consistency. 8 87 I can still remember AM 1470, CJVB's 9 original marketing philosophy, encapsulated in the 10 phrase "radio for all Canadians". In light of Canada's 11 increasing cultural diversity, it appears to me that 12 Type E programming should play a much larger role if 13 multicultural radio is to better reflect Canadian 14 society through enlightenment, awareness and 15 understanding. It also makes this important service 16 more complimentary to the other resources technology 17 has made available to ethnic communities. 18 88 Briefly, on ethnic television, a 19 picture is worth a thousand words, and moving pictures 20 speak volumes no matter what your language. Television 21 can better provide a comprehensive service to a wide 22 array of cultural communities without alienating other 23 segments of their viewing audience. SCMO licenses, 24 while hindered by our west coast topography and the 25 immobility of the system can provide specialized StenoTran 25 1 language programming to communities who show need for a 2 24-hour specific third language service. 3 89 Public and campus radio operate at 4 low power and can offer only limited service to a few 5 cultural communities living within a tight geographical 6 are. I also don't think it's reasonable to rely on 7 mainstream radio to "take up the slack". 8 90 Currently, mainstream broadcasters 9 may devote up to 15 percent of their weekly schedules 10 to programming in Types A to D. Yet, in Vancouver, no 11 mainstream broadcaster, to my knowledge, has taken 12 advantage of this opportunity. It makes sense that for 13 the sake of consistency, they have no desire to 14 alienate their established audience with the inclusion 15 of third language programming. 16 91 The advent of the Internet presents a 17 strong argument for re-analyzing the very nature of 18 multicultural radio. News and current events from "the 19 homeland" are abundant and accessible on the Net. A 20 music intensive, Type E radio program would compliment 21 this information service nicely. 22 92 To illustrate, a Canadian of Finnish 23 heritage could sit down at the computer with a cup of 24 coffee, scan the daily newspapers hot off the press in 25 Helsinki, while listening to the exciting next StenoTran 26 1 generation of Finnish folk music from groups like 2 "Hednigarna" or "Varttina" -- part of a Worldbeat-style 3 Type E radio program on "real audio". 4 93 A greater emphasis on cross-cultural 5 programming will also fill a void in the promotion of 6 Canadian ethnic music talent. Vancouver, for instance, 7 has the international reputation as "The World Music 8 Capital". Strangely, the people least aware of that 9 fact are living here on the West Coast. Radio 10 programming reflective of our cultural diversity can 11 spotlight, not only local talent from specific ethnic 12 backgrounds, but the many gifted artists who are fusing 13 different cultural elements together into new forms of 14 musical expression. 15 94 Type E programming can also be 16 readily woven into ethnic radio's existing broadcast 17 schedules along with Types B, C and D to create longer 18 blocks of listening time with more universal appeal, 19 increasing the broadcaster's potential for making the 20 programming, outside of their Type A breadwinners, also 21 self-sufficient. 22 95 Nevertheless, ethnic radio, like 23 mainstream radio, must be able to positively identify 24 its listeners if it's to attract revenues from agencies 25 and corporate advertisers. Here in Vancouver, a new, StenoTran 27 1 contemporary, music-intensive form of multicultural 2 radio is already cultivating an enthusiastic audience. 3 Some listeners attest to tuning in for nine hours at a 4 stretch through five different cultural programs -- 5 unheard of in ethnic radio. But without survey 6 information, it's impossible to estimate their numbers. 7 96 As a show of commitment to these 8 listeners, out of respect for the licensees who took a 9 chance on such a bold new approach and in deference to 10 the Commission, who seek direction for the industry, it 11 would seem such a survey would be of great value. 12 97 It's my hope that in addition to 13 these public consultations, the Commission will 14 consider underwriting an audience survey of Canadian 15 ethnic radio as a case study. 16 98 Thank you very much for this 17 opportunity. 18 99 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 19 much, Mr. Koat. 20 100 THE SECRETARY: I'd now like to 21 invite Valerie Dare to make her presentation. 22 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 23 101 MS DARE: Members of the CRTC. I'm 24 listed as number 4, but I'm actually a very small "b" 25 under 3, because it was suggested by Cal that you might StenoTran 28 1 be interested in hearing some of the ways in which 2 ethnic broadcasting affects me and my work. 3 102 I'm a teacher/librarian at Britannia 4 Secondary Community School, an inner-city school of 5 about 1,000 students situated in East Vancouver, in the 6 lowest socio-economic neighbourhood in Canada. 7 103 The student population represents 100 8 ethnic groups speaking 40 different languages and 87 9 percent speak English as a second language. Because of 10 the ethnic diversity of our school, there is a 11 potential for either cultural harmony or racial 12 conflict, depending on how well the school programs 13 meet student needs. 14 104 Anti-racist education and programs 15 that foster cultural understanding and appreciation are 16 therefore important features of the educational program 17 at Britannia. They are offered as part of the 18 curriculum or through special programs that enhance and 19 enrich regular studies. 20 105 In my work as a teacher/librarian, I 21 develop learning activities that reflect and celebrate 22 the multicultural nature of Britannia. An approach I 23 have found particularly effective is to use music as a 24 way to investigate cultures. I integrate music with 25 curriculum studies in many subject areas by developing StenoTran 29 1 learning resources that encourage students to find out 2 about the lives of people around the world. An example 3 is the unit "Rhythm of Resistance" which looked at the 4 Apartheid regime of South Africa through the music 5 which was both an outcome of and reaction to social 6 brutalization. 7 106 Special World Music programs enhance 8 students' experiences at Britannia. "Sharing 9 Cultures", a World Music symposium for international 10 backed laureate program students held last December 11 provided hands-on opportunities for young people to 12 work directly with artists to learn dances, play music 13 and build instruments. 14 107 Another project will see the 15 construction of three sets of marimbas representing the 16 cultures of Southern Africa, West Africa and Latin 17 America. Made in the woodwork shop under the guidance 18 of the woodwork teacher and a musician from each of the 19 cultures, the marimbas will provide authentic 20 instruments for use in music education classes. 21 108 A final example is World Music Day, a 22 made-in-Vancouver event -- coming up on February the 23 18th, by the way -- that celebrates the contributions 24 to cultural understanding made by musicians from 25 diverse cultures. At Britannia, we are collaborating StenoTran 30 1 with the media and broadcasters, such as Fairchild 2 Radio, to bring performances and classroom workshops to 3 the school and an evening concert to the communities. 4 109 I am not a music specialist and yet 5 I've established a small reputation in the specialized 6 field of World Music education. How have I learned 7 what I need to know in order to develop curriculum 8 materials and organize programs that are respectful and 9 accurate? I acquire knowledge and understanding by 10 talking to artists from the cultures, listening to 11 ethnic programming on CBC, Fairchild and co-op radio 12 stations and viewing ethnocultural television programs 13 on the CBC, Knowledge, Bravo!, Rogers and Vision. 14 110 Type E programming is crucial for my 15 own personal knowledge, and in the transfer of that 16 knowledge to students in my school. The 17 recommendations I wish to make therefore, pertain 18 mainly to Type E programming. And I've got a list of 19 five of them, but I don't know if you want me to read 20 them out of just leave them with you. 21 111 THE CHAIRPERSON: You can leave them 22 with us or read them out, whatever's your preference. 23 112 MS DARE: Sure. Okay. I'll leave 24 them with you. 25 113 THE CHAIRPERSON: So thank you very StenoTran 31 1 much -- 2 114 MS DARE: You're welcome. 3 115 THE CHAIRPERSON: -- Ms Dare. 4 116 THE SECRETARY: Would Vera Radyo make 5 her presentation now, please? 6 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 7 117 MS RADYO: Thank you. Good afternoon 8 Commissioners Grauer and Cardozo and thank you for the 9 opportunity to appear before you. 10 118 My name is Vera Radyo and I'm the 11 Executive Director of AMSSA or the Affiliation of 12 Multicultural Societies and Service Agencies of B.C. 13 119 AMSSA is a non-profit coalition of 80 14 multicultural and immigrant serving organizations which 15 are on the front-line of serving ethnic communities in 16 our culturally diverse population throughout B.C. 17 120 And I have to say that we have 18 trouble with the word "ethnic" because we are all 19 ethnic and we all have an ethnic background, but 20 because you refer to that in your questions and in the 21 title of this consultation, we do use it occasionally 22 in the brief, but our language, I guess, needs more 23 clarity, anyway... 24 121 Our coalition represents all the 25 major community societies promoting multiculturalism StenoTran 32 1 and anti-racism in our province. Some of the 2 organizations are large and well-known, such as 3 SUCCESS, MOSAIC, Immigrant Services Society. Some of 4 our members are small and operate in outlying areas 5 with a small budget and volunteer staff. Some serve 6 victims of torture, others focus on women's issues and 7 most assist immigrants to participate in the 8 socio-economic fabric of our communities. All of our 9 members are in the position of feeling the pulse of 10 diverse communities and readily share their concerns, 11 frustrations and visions. 12 122 Thank you for taking this important 13 initiative and affording us the opportunity to share 14 those concerns, frustrations and visions with you. 15 AMSSA is, we believe, in a unique position to assist 16 the Commission to review its policy on programming in 17 other languages to culturally diverse communities. 18 2. Background 19 123 We live in a world that is, put, as 20 we approach the 21st Century, which is quite different 21 from the one that the Commission faced even 15 years 22 ago when a broadcasting policy reflecting Canada's 23 cultural and linguistic diversity was issued on July 24 4th, 1985. There have been major demographic and 25 technological changes that underscore the importance of StenoTran 33 1 your task and the immensity of your challenge. 2 124 According to the 1996 Statistics 3 Canada Census Data, the percentage of visible 4 minorities has nearly doubled from 6.3 in '86 to 11.2 5 in 1996. In British Columbia in 1996, we had the 6 second largest visible minority population in Canada 7 after Ontario. There were 661,000 persons in B.C. who 8 were members of a visible minority group. These 9 individuals accounted for 18 percent of B.C.'s total 10 population, the highest proportion of any province. 11 125 Although one-half of the province's 12 population resides in the Lower Mainland, approximately 13 85 percent of B.C.'s visible minority population does. 14 AMSSA represents the entire province and we know that 15 there are large culturally diverse communities 16 throughout B.C. However, the weight of the challenge 17 lies in the Lower Mainland. Of the more than 630,000 18 immigrants in the Lower Mainland, 54 percent have 19 arrived within the last 15 years, according to the 20 Census, so now we're at '99, so it would be even higher 21 than that. Who knows? Perhaps with immigration closer 22 to 60 percent. Creatively address the challenge 23 locally and there will be adaptable spin-offs which can 24 be applied elsewhere in the province. 25 126 And we have included in the back, StenoTran 34 1 Appendix of extrapolated information from the '96 2 Census showing visible minorities in Vancouver, Lower 3 Mainland Population by Mother Tongue and the Total 4 Immigrant Population by Period. 5 127 We shall now address the three 6 questions which the Commission has highlighted: 7 "To what extent does the present 8 broadcasting system adequately 9 serve Canada's ethnocultural 10 communities?" 11 128 Although the 1985 policy statement 12 and subsequent initiatives by the Commission and 13 broadcasters may have been well-intentioned, we are of 14 the opinion that the broadcasting system is not meeting 15 the needs of these diverse communities. Our members 16 have surveyed the immigrant communities inquiring how 17 groups prefer to receive information regarding social 18 integration issues. The results have strongly 19 indicated that communities would like to rely primarily 20 on the broadcast media, particularly television, to 21 assist them to glean the necessary information to make 22 crucial decisions in their adjustment to Canadian life. 23 Sadly, for the most part, it is our opinion that that 24 assistance is lacking. 25 129 Although some stations have made StenoTran 35 1 attempts to use visible minority reporters, for 2 examples, and that in itself has positive effects, 3 those reports are not reflective of culturally diverse 4 communities. They are by their nature, representations 5 by the established news media with their own 6 perspectives. It is obvious that the station managers, 7 the program directors, the decision makers and the 8 power brokers represent the white middle class 9 constituency which the station serves. We strongly 10 recommend that when approving licenses, broadcasters 11 should be required to employ staff at all levels of 12 their organization that reflect the diversity of the 13 population being served. 14 130 On the other end of the broadcast 15 spectrum is the Community Multicultural Channel, 16 Channel 20, Rogers Cablesystems -- that made the 17 initial presentation -- which does a commendable job 18 but is under-resourced and operated by volunteers 19 resulting in variable quality broadcasting. The manner 20 in which the programming is presented begs the 21 question: How is it decided who gets access to the 22 outlet and equitable allotment of time and resources? 23 Are any attempts made to reach out to the most 24 disenfranchised -- usually those less educated, 25 unfamiliar with access and the poor? What are support StenoTran 36 1 systems? How and to what extent is training offered? 2 And what are the expectations of content? And how is 3 quality and contented monitored? Where are the lines 4 of accountability? 5 131 You know, we don't know the answers 6 to these questions, and that's why we're asking them, 7 but we have heard from our members concerns about these 8 issues. 9 132 Also, if quality programs were 10 produced locally for the Greater Vancouver market, is 11 there a mechanism in place to share those programs with 12 other cable systems in the province? 13 133 The second question: 14 "Given the demographic changes 15 that have taken place in Canada, 16 how can the needs and interests 17 of ethnocultural communities 18 continue to be served?" 19 134 We noted with keen interest that the 20 CRTC Chairperson, Françoise Bertrand, at the House of 21 Commons Standing Committee on Canadian Heritage on 22 April 23rd, 1998, stated: 23 "We believe Canadians are seeing 24 the evolution of a new 25 Commission. The new CRTC will StenoTran 37 1 say 'regulate if it necessary', 2 but where appropriate, we would 3 prefer to let the industry 4 self-regulate under monitoring." 5 135 We urge the CRTC to determine that 6 ethnocultural broadcasting is one area that requires an 7 intervention and impetus to ensure that communities are 8 well served. Now is the time for the CRTC to make some 9 bold policy statements and reinforce those ideals when 10 Promises of Performance or POP's are submitted and 11 licences are renewed. We are sure that decisive, 12 creative measures can turn the tide and produce 13 worthwhile results of which we can all be proud and 14 pleased. There would be no priority community channels 15 had not the CRTC stipulated their use. Canadian 16 content has both been an attainable ideal and an 17 economic success. 18 136 We are not suggesting an 19 iron-fisted-rule-by-regulation approach. By its very 20 nature, ethnic broadcasting needs to be flexible and 21 reflective of various communities and subcultures. 22 However, we are advocating a strong, pro-active, 23 supportive intervention. 24 137 We recommend that an Ethnocultural 25 Broadcasting Advisory Council be established. This StenoTran 38 1 council would be a community-based, cross-cultural, 2 multi-disciplinary organization and would function both 3 as an ombuds person watchdog monitoring the system and 4 a professional advisory board to assist various 5 communities become actively involved in creative 6 broadcasting. With a few paid professionals and 7 support staff, the council would be primarily composed 8 of volunteer members from culturally diverse 9 communities. At CFRO-FM, Vancouver Co-op Radio, BCIT 10 broadcast students and community cable systems could 11 help provide hands-on training and experience. 12 Vancouver's ethnic radio stations could both contribute 13 to and benefit from such a council. The council would 14 ensure that a truly cooperative, multicultural approach 15 be applied to broadcasting to avoid "ghettoizing" the 16 ethnic voice. The council would be a vehicle to 17 promote further understanding and invoke interaction 18 across ethnic lines for the common good of Canadian 19 society as a whole and the respective communities in 20 particular. Common goals would be established and 21 individual differences would be accepted and 22 celebrated. 23 138 AMSSA has been impressed by the 24 approach of CFMT-TV in Toronto. The key features of 25 CFMT that we support are high quality professional StenoTran 39 1 broadcasting, Canadian programming focusing on issues 2 central to the communities, wide range of linguistic 3 groups represented, central accountability, corporate 4 philosophy promoting cross-cultural understanding and 5 key Canadian values, and programming that assists the 6 social integration of newcomers. We are confident that 7 the Lower Mainland could both emulate their success, 8 learn from their operation and eventually share 9 programming, either on a formal or informal networking 10 basis. 11 139 One of the areas which gravely 12 concerns us is the use of SCMO signals being broadcast 13 from Washington State into the Lower Mainland in the 14 Punjabi language. Our constituents inform us, and the 15 media confirm, the material being broadcast is hate and 16 violence mongering. Although the role and function of 17 the CRTC is not to closely monitor all on-air signals, 18 let alone SCMO signals from another country, we urge 19 the CRTC to take decisive action and refer the matter 20 to the proper governing bodies. One of the functions 21 of the proposed Ethnocultural Broadcasting Council 22 might well be to monitor such broadcasts and lodge 23 complaints when necessary. 24 "Should there be a priority on 25 the development of Canadian StenoTran 40 1 ethnocultural services rather 2 than importing foreign 3 services?" 4 140 In a word: Absolutely. If 5 middle-class, English speaking, white Canadians have 6 the choice of watching 50-plus TV channels, it could be 7 argued that culturally diverse communities should also 8 have the option of watching a much greater diversity of 9 television programming than they now have access to. 10 141 There are two reasons why the 11 appalling practice of filling time slots resorts to 12 foreign programs, and neither of them relates to a 13 nostalgic longing for the homeland. In the first 14 place, it is the easiest way to do "ethnic" programming 15 and outlets will often seek the path of least 16 resistance. Secondly, the ethnic communities often 17 lack the resources, training, contacts and experience 18 in the Canadian system to produce their own quality 19 programming. The proposed council could take definite 20 steps to ensure that outlets live up to their Promise 21 of Performance and that groups that are assisted in 22 obtaining their own Canadian programming. A "Canadian 23 content" guideline needs to be established to ensure 24 that the path of least resistance is not pursued. A 25 multilingual broadcast quality TV outlet would be a StenoTran 41 1 step in the right direction. 2 4. Conclusion 3 142 And in conclusion, I want to thank 4 you for this opportunity to appear before you and if 5 you have questions, we'd be pleased to try and answer 6 them and also if you feel there are areas you would 7 like AMSSA to research, we would attempt to do so and 8 forward our findings to you. 9 143 Thank you. 10 144 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms 11 Radyo. I think Commissioner Cardozo has one question 12 of clarification. 13 145 COMMISSIONER CARDOZO: I'm going to 14 break a rule and ask just one very quick question. 15 146 When you talk about the Ethnocultural 16 Advisory Council, what was your thought about who would 17 set that up? 18 147 MS RADYO: Well, we thought it could 19 be something that could be mandated by CRTC and that 20 the various stations that, with their Promise of 21 Performance, could contribute financially to make it 22 happen, but that it would be a central operation and 23 that it, you know, almost like a -- we haven't given a 24 lot of thought to structure, but almost like a subset 25 of CRTC that it would help fulfil the mandate, but it StenoTran 42 1 would be composed of people from the community, from a 2 broad range of communities, and that it would help to 3 look at the kinds of quality... 4 148 Like, we get complaints from people 5 saying: 1) they don't have access to some of the 6 current programming when they want to do Canadian 7 content and social integration issues. We gets 8 complaints about, you know, who's monitoring the 9 content and, you know, how much Canadian content there 10 is. So, an overseeing body and we think that the 11 cross-cultural linkages are really important. 12 149 COMMISSIONER CARDOZO: Thanks very 13 much. 14 150 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms 15 Radyo. 16 151 THE SECRETARY: Would Stuart Morton 17 make his presentation, please? 18 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 19 152 MR. MORTON: Thank you. 20 153 Commissioners Grauer and Cardozo, my 21 name is Stu Morton, Vice President of the O.K. Radio 22 Group. With me are Diana Parker, General Manager of 23 CKER-FM in Edmonton and Brian Blackburn, Vice President 24 of Sales for our company. 25 154 O.K. Radio owns both mainstream and StenoTran 43 1 ethnic radio stations. We operate three mainstream FM 2 stations in Alberta, as well as an AM/FM combo in 3 Victoria. CKER-FM is our ethnic station in Edmonton 4 and has been serving that community since 1980. We 5 also have a 50 percent interest in partnership with 6 Fairchild Media of Vancouver in two new ethnic FM 7 stations, CHKG in Vancouver and CHKF in Calgary. 8 155 First let me say that we believe the 9 Commission's ethnic policy is working. Ethnic radio in 10 Canada has grown since the introduction of the policy 11 and continues to evolve and strengthen. 12 156 In the process of reviewing ethnic 13 broadcasting, we believe it's essential to remember 14 that Canada's ethnic broadcast services are being 15 provided almost exclusively by independent private 16 broadcast operators. These stations are business 17 operations that must achieve a firm level of 18 profitability. In fact, the economic nature of ethnic 19 radio broadcasting is fundamentally the same as 20 mainstream broadcasting. Radio is a mass medium. 21 Canadian ethnic radio stations are advertiser supported 22 and as such are subject to the same economic dynamics 23 that every private radio station must address. 24 157 Advertisers must be persuaded that a 25 sufficiently large definable audience exists on the StenoTran 44 1 station and that is both a qualitative, as well as a 2 quantitative challenge. Advertisers need to understand 3 the tangible nature of the audience, as well as its 4 numerical size. The station's audience has to make 5 some sense on a qualitative level. It must not be too 6 fragmented and unconnected. 7 158 Advertisers generally prefer to use a 8 specialized medium to reach the smaller more 9 specialized audiences. It's simply a matter of 10 advertising logic. It makes more sense to direct your 11 entire radio budget at, for instance, the Chinese 12 community in Vancouver and use a more specialized 13 medium to reach other, smaller groups. 14 159 MS PARKER: In the programming area, 15 our experience is that ethnic radio audiences listen 16 and remain loyal to a station only if it serves as a 17 link to the homeland, but also keeps them informed at 18 the community level, as well as at the city, 19 provincial, national and international levels. We 20 believe that no special rules are needed to ensure that 21 ethnic radio provides this kind of service. 22 160 There is little need, in our view, 23 for a distinction between ethnic programming Types A, 24 B, C and D. The market dictates the type of 25 programming that can sustain advertising revenue, and StenoTran 45 1 that is generally Type A. 2 161 The 60 percent minimum requirement of 3 current Types A to D ethnic programming may no longer 4 be necessary in a new ethnic framework, as radio 5 stations that are committed to this speciality 6 programming generally broadcast well above the 60 7 percent minimum. 8 162 The 40 percent or less of the weekly 9 schedule that in the current policy need not contain 10 ethnic programming should, however, be left to the 11 discretion of each broadcaster. On our Edmonton 12 station, for example, ethnic programming accounts for 13 over 72 percent of our weekly schedule, but paid 14 religious programming in English is still a significant 15 part of our total revenue. 16 163 The audience for Type E programming 17 is very difficult, virtually impossible to define and 18 it is consequently not commercially viable. 19 164 MR. MORTON: We understand that some 20 ethnic communities may not feel that they have access 21 to their ideal level of service, we were recently 22 unable to provide more than an hour long program block 23 to a Polish producer who requested five hours on CHKG 24 in Vancouver. Obviously, there are only so many hours 25 per week, many of which must be devoted to serving the StenoTran 46 1 dominant ethnic community or the station risks being 2 marginalized in terms of its relevance to its most 3 important source of revenue. 4 165 Our Vancouver station must deal with 5 the realities of serving the huge Chinese community. 6 That's what keeps the station in business. It also 7 uses up a great deal of the station's resources. In 8 fact, the resources needed to produce nine hours of 9 Chinese programming in Vancouver are about the same as 10 those that would be needed to produce a typical 24-hour 11 schedule on any station, ethnic or otherwise. That's 12 the fundamental reality of any ethnic radio station. 13 German programming in Edmonton, Chinese programming in 14 Vancouver are only a portion of the weekly programming 15 schedule and yet the cost of producing these programs 16 is virtually the same as full-time programming in a 17 typical radio station. 18 166 The financial results, in the case of 19 CKER in Edmonton is that it has never been able to 20 achieve operating income levels of more than two or 21 three percent of revenue. In fact, we have subsidized 22 its operation from our mainstream stations almost 23 continuously over the past ten years. 24 167 MR. BLACKBURN: If ethnic radio is to 25 grow, it must be allowed to achieve firmer profit StenoTran 47 1 levels in markets such as Edmonton and Vancouver. 2 Radio programming flexibility is the key to a stronger, 3 healthier ethnic radio industry. 4 168 We believe there are conditions under 5 which an ethnic station offering only one or two 6 languages should be licensed, particularly in Canada's 7 largest cities. In smaller urban centres, such as 8 Edmonton and Calgary, where stations tend to offer 9 broadbased programming, there's still a need for the 10 station to find ways to control operating costs through 11 more streamlined programming. In larger centres, such 12 as Vancouver, where very large linguistic and cultural 13 communities exist, stations must be totally immersed in 14 the culture of that one ethnic community. This can 15 only be achieved by devoting virtually all of the 16 station's resources to programming in that language and 17 culture. 18 1700 19 169 There is an important role for 20 specialty media in serving ethnic communities. SCMO, 21 the Internet, campus and community stations, as well as 22 cable can increasingly serve smaller ethnic groups. 23 Webcasting on the Internet offers a tremendous 24 opportunity in this regard. Wireless Internet services 25 are even starting to appear. We have recently been StenoTran 48 1 negotiating with a large locally based Internet 2 provider on Vancouver Island who wishes to lease tower 3 space for this type of service. Webcasting offers a 4 much lower cost platform that is more appropriate to 5 smaller ethnic communities where the economies simply 6 don't work in the traditional radio environment. 7 170 We believe that Webcasting can evolve 8 as a tool for both the radio station and the ethnic 9 community. We can work with ethnic groups to partner 10 in developing web-based programming which in many cases 11 can be a springboard to regular programs over the air. 12 171 MS PARKER: With respect to music, 13 Canadian content requirements for recorded music in 14 languages other than English and French are a 15 particularly difficult challenge to our stations. 16 172 The Commission has asked if the 17 availability of Canadian ethnic musical selections has 18 increased over the past 14 years. Our answer is that 19 it has increased, but primarily in languages such as 20 Spanish, Italian, Portugese and Ukrainian. There is 21 still virtually no material in Chinese, Polish and 22 other markets where the immigration patterns are 23 creating large population growth. 24 173 Even at the existing 7 percent, the 25 lack of Canadian content results in the overuse of a StenoTran 49 1 small amount of material. Any increase would serve 2 only to diminish the exposure of the large variety of 3 music from international artists who represent the rich 4 heritage of the ethnic audiences we are licensed to 5 serve. 6 174 Our ethnic radio producers 7 enthusiastically support and promote their own ethnic 8 Canadian artists, whether they perform in English, 9 French or a third language. Many of these performers 10 have successful careers as club and/or concert artists 11 in Canada and elsewhere. Canada's record companies do 12 not provide mass promotion and sales support for ethnic 13 music because the markets are too fragmented. 14 175 Contemporary ethnic artists either 15 cross over into the mainstream market, or continue to 16 perform primarily for their own communities here and 17 abroad. Raising the level of Canadian content on 18 ethnic radio will not create a Canadian ethnic 19 recording industry. 20 176 MR. MORTON: Thank you very much. 21 That's our presentation and since you have no 22 questions, I guess we're done. 23 177 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 24 much. 25 178 THE SECRETARY: I would ask Phangsy StenoTran 50 1 Nou to make her presentation now. 2 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 3 179 MS NOU: Good evening ladies and 4 gentlemen. My name is Phangsy Nou. I am Cambodia or 5 "Khmer". I came from South East Asia, called 6 "Kampuchea" or Cambodia. I am the Cambodian Community 7 Family Support and Integration Worker. 8 180 There are approximately 1,800 9 Cambodian Community members in the Lower Mainland. 10 181 As a newcomer, or immigrant, we often 11 are enthusiastic, curious and full of excitement. We 12 are also sometimes confused and afraid. After a while, 13 we start to see the true nature of our new home 14 country. There is also often a feeling a nostalgia for 15 what has been lost. Some newcomers attempt to use old 16 solutions to new problems. Some isolate themselves and 17 choose to live in their own community. Some adjust to 18 their professional lives in Canada, but keep their 19 personal life separate. 20 182 The long term difficulties of the 21 civil war and the refugee experiences made it 22 impossible for most Cambodian people to benefit from 23 many settlement services when they were first offered 24 at time of arrival. 25 183 Even now, the Cambodian community has StenoTran 51 1 been here in Canada usually between 10 to 20 years, 2 they still need help, language issue. 3 184 Coming to Canada, Cambodian people 4 feel free, but they have barriers; linguistic, lack of 5 employment opportunity, appropriately structured 6 educational opportunity, information on how to access 7 services, information on recreation and social 8 events -- in the Cambodian community and the wide 9 Canadian community. Example: traditional respect from 10 young generation, et cetera, building English language 11 skills is a main problem for ethnocultural communities. 12 185 The Cambodian Community Family 13 Support and Integration Project works to meet the high 14 priority needs of Cambodians living in Vancouver/Lower 15 Mainland to preserve culture, tradition and language 16 while supporting adaptation and integration in the 17 Lower Mainland to extend English language skill -- all 18 ages -- and access to accurate information and 19 referral, et cetera. 20 186 We need to get the word out to our 21 people about health initiatives, education 22 possibilities, citizenship matters, training and 23 employment opportunities, provision of cultural sharing 24 social and recreational events. 25 187 Since many of our people do not read StenoTran 52 1 or write in either Khmer or English, radio and 2 television are important information and integration 3 tools for us to concentrate on. 4 188 We feel this kind of radio 5 communication and television is vital to the improved 6 well being of our community and integration in Canadian 7 life. 8 189 We would like to reach our Cambodian 9 people on a regular basis being able to use the radio 10 and television which are the easiest for them to 11 understand. We would like to provide cultural sharing 12 of music which is very much missed, and also to provide 13 critical information on how to address social, 14 educational, health and employment issues. In 15 addition, information on community events and 16 perspectives and include information on events in the 17 wider Canadian community, information on living in a 18 democratic system and respecting human rights. 19 190 It is for all these reasons that our 20 organization is interested on the particular matters 21 under consideration here today. 22 191 For Question 1 of the CRTC 23 consultation: 24 192 It is my view and the view of many 25 members of my community, the present broadcasting StenoTran 53 1 system does not serve ethnocultural communities well 2 enough. 3 193 One point is that ethnocultural 4 communities often do not have information about 5 ethnocultural programming that the present broadcasting 6 system is providing so there can be no benefit to us in 7 this case. 8 194 Another point is that often the 9 ethnocultural programming is put together by sources 10 outside of Canada. Sometimes this means that the 11 issues of ethnocultural communities in Canada are not 12 talked about. The information may be a little 13 interesting to us, but it often cannot address our 14 daily concerns or our needs. 15 195 Another point is that local and 16 regional community members here in B.C. can help make 17 programming very beneficial, if they are part of the 18 program planning process for programs made locally or 19 regionally in Canada. 20 196 Another point is local and regional 21 consultation is essential to determine the priority for 22 contact of any externally purchased program is also 23 important. 24 197 Come to the Question 2: 25 198 It is my view and the view of many of StenoTran 54 1 my community members that separate ethnic programming 2 needs to be maintained and protected within overall 3 broadcasting policy. 4 199 We do not feel that market forces can 5 be relied upon to ensure that the needs of 6 ethnocultural groups are met. 7 200 We say this because market forces 8 tend to focus on the interests of large groups or 9 wealthy groups, rather than less dominant groups or 10 groups facing barriers. 11 201 Mainstream media, to date, deals with 12 third language/culture issues very rarely and usually 13 poorly. 14 202 Media is an important tool in helping 15 ethnocultural communities learn about Canada and learn 16 to function well in Canada. The ethnocultural media is 17 doing the best job for most newcomers. 18 203 Come to the Question 3: 19 204 We strongly support the position that 20 there is a special role for Canadian ethnic 21 programming. As indicated in our response to the first 22 two consultations questions ethnic programming gives us 23 a voice and a learning/teaching tool. 24 205 Ethnic programming is very important 25 to ethnocultural communities for the first and second StenoTran 55 1 generation Canadians. Ethnocultural media plays an 2 important unique role that does all the things your 3 background information sheet mentions. Example: link 4 people to their country of origin; reflect Canada; 5 promote cross-cultural understanding; strengthen, unite 6 and bridge ethnocultural community within and between 7 groups both locally and across the country; provide 8 newcomers with a means to better and fully participate 9 in Canadian society by informing listeners about their 10 community, current issues, governments and the work. 11 206 Emphasis that mainstream media does 12 not generally address these issues. 13 Policy Points 14 207 The policy points, I have four. 15 208 One: It is important that CRTC 16 policy especially requires the provision of programming 17 for and by ethnocultural communities particularly the 18 smaller ethnocultural communities. The smaller 19 communities particularly require this so that these 20 essential programs which are key information tools to 21 these new Canadians can be sustained. This programming 22 can only be sustained if it is protected by policy. 23 209 Two: It is important the CRTC policy 24 mandate reliable and timely strategies be implemented 25 by broadcasters working with community to ensure StenoTran 56 1 community have information on both (a) imported 2 ethnocultural programming and (b) programming produced 3 locally or anywhere in Canada. 4 210 Three: Policy is needed which 5 requires local and regional consultation to determine 6 the priority for any of externally purchased programs. 7 211 Four: Ethnic programming needs: 8 Available and accessible programming in languages other 9 than English and French; to provide essential 10 information for ethnic groups about their communities; 11 and to provide Canadian programming connecting people 12 to their lives in Canada; to recognize diversities of 13 language and culture; to provide accessible and free 14 ethnic and third language programming; to provide 15 balanced ethnic and third language information from a 16 variety of sources. 17 212 Thank you for your consideration of 18 this submission. 19 213 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms Nou. 20 214 THE SECRETARY: And now would Hardeep 21 Dhaliwal make her presentation, please? 22 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 23 215 MS DHALIWAL: My name is Hardeep 24 Dhaliwal and I have worked both in the media and in 25 multiculturalism. In fact, once of my tasks right now StenoTran 57 1 is media training workshops for multicultural groups to 2 help them place their stories in the mainstream media. 3 216 They want to target the mainstream 4 because it's the biggest sector of the media and the 5 most powerful. They want the stories of people from 6 diverse communities told to the mainstream audience, as 7 well as to the ethnic audiences to promote a better 8 understanding between groups of people. 9 217 To be reflected in the mainstream 10 lends a certain type of acceptance. It means you have 11 arrived, you are a part of Canada. This is important 12 to people who don't come from the dominant culture. 13 The media is an important gatekeeper for the sense of 14 community and belonging, but the complaints I hear 15 about the media centre around not enough stories about 16 diverse communities and the stories which are aired are 17 often negative. In Vancouver, we've heard a lot about 18 the Honduran drug dealers, the Asian gangs and the Sikh 19 extremists. These labels damage the reputation of the 20 entire community. 21 218 To give the media credit from the 22 mainstream, they do try to balance the score, but this 23 is often done with the annual story about "Devali" (ph) 24 or Chinese New Year. That was okay in the sixties 25 maybe, but Vancouver is now too big and too diverse to StenoTran 58 1 continue like this. The present broadcasting system 2 does not serve the ethnocultural communities in this 3 city. There are too many good stories out there which 4 are being missed. 5 219 What is the solution? How can there 6 be places created on the dial for radio and television 7 with a mandate to reflect ethnocultural communities? 8 Right now, most of the ethnic media is found on cable, 9 Pay stations, or on the SCMO boxes. The ethnic media 10 in Vancouver must move to over-the-air channels. They 11 need the same resources to have the same quality 12 programming as the mainstream media. This programming 13 should be free and accessible to everyone. 14 220 At this time, market forces may not 15 be relied upon to ensure that ethnocultural groups have 16 access to broadcasting about their communities or in 17 their languages. It is my opinion that the CRTC must 18 maintain a separate ethnic broadcasting system until 19 the marketplace is friendlier to ethnocultural news and 20 languages. 21 221 I read the 15 page Public Notice the 22 CRTC sent out back in December and from what I read, 23 the multicultural broadcast policy looks broad and 24 detailed. I would just like to see more of the policy 25 used in Vancouver. By that, I mean some of the things StenoTran 59 1 that I've just mentioned, more ethnocultural programs, 2 both in English and in other languages. 3 222 You ask a question about foreign 4 versus Canadian programming. It's very important to 5 see quality programs produced in Canada which provide a 6 unique view of Canadian issues and Canadian experience. 7 I would like to see a safe place where contentious 8 issues from a community can be discussed without fear 9 of reprisal. I think an argument can also be made for 10 bringing in high quality foreign programs, a balance 11 between both Canadian and foreign produced programs 12 would probably be the most popular choice. 13 223 In the CRTC's Public Notice, I see 14 quite a lot of discussion about third language 15 programs. I grew up in B.C. speaking only Punjabi 16 until I started school. I remember hearing that Canada 17 was a bilingual country, I thought that meant English 18 and Punjabi. Later, I learned French and spent four 19 years living and working in Québec. There, I was an 20 "Allophone". When I returned to Vancouver, I started 21 working on my lapsed Punjabi, which had remained in 22 suspended animation at the level of a six year old. I 23 still have a long way to go, but I persist because as a 24 person of colour in this country, I feel I have to 25 maintain my cultural identity to keep me strong in some StenoTran 60 1 of the challenges I face and I believe that language is 2 the key to culture. 3 224 So I endorse the policies which 4 protect third language broadcasting, but I will restate 5 that I would like to see the ethnocultural media in 6 Vancouver on a more equal footing with their 7 counterparts in the mainstream media in terms of having 8 over the air high-quality programming. 9 225 Thank you very much. 10 226 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 11 much, Ms Dhaliwal. 12 227 THE SECRETARY: This brings to a 13 close the first group of presenters, but I beg your 14 indulgence. Mr. Alavi is here and his daughter is in 15 the hospital, he has to leave within the next, probably 16 20 minutes and I'm wondering if you'd all mind just 17 staying in place and giving Mr. Alavi a microphone so 18 that he can make his presentation. 19 228 Thank you very much. 20 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 21 229 MR. ALAVI: Ladies and gentlemen, 22 thank you very much for providing this opportunity to 23 me to speak before the break. 24 230 My name is Sam Alavi. I'm the 25 Program Producer for Rogers Cablesystems, and serving StenoTran 61 1 the Iranian community in the Lower Mainland. 2 231 Please be advised that as an 3 experienced Iranian television programming provided in 4 Canada, I would like to submit my comments and 5 suggestions in regard to multilingual and ethnic 6 programming to the Commission to be reviewed as part of 7 policy-making for Canadian broadcasting systems. 8 232 I strongly believe that the present 9 broadcasting system does not adequately serve Canada's 10 fast-growing ethnocultural and multilingual 11 communities, including the Iranians, due to the 12 following reasons: 13 233 The broadcasting tools and media 14 serving the Canadian ethnocultural communities are very 15 limited and accessing most of them are far too 16 expensive for the qualified programming providers who 17 do not presently have a variety of choices to present 18 their productions to the respected communities. So far 19 Vision TV, F8 (ph) cable network based in Toronto, 20 Ontario which devotes just their Saturday scheduled 21 time slots to ethnic programming in return for 22 reasonable price rates and the Rogers Multicultural 23 Channel of Rogers Cablesystems in Vancouver as the only 24 available telecast media in Western Canada, which 25 pioneered ethnocultural programming in the growing StenoTran 62 1 environment of the Lower Mainland of B.C. are the only 2 available alternatives for access. 3 234 The guidelines imposed by the CRTC 4 for restricted advertising on Rogers Multicultural 5 Channel and the lack of funding are two of the main 6 suffering drawbacks facing channels hard working and 7 committed management and also programming suppliers. 8 235 In spite of the unfortunate fact the 9 RMC, Rogers Multicultural Channel, mandate to serve the 10 approached communities with the programming of their 11 own language and culture, and the channel's outstanding 12 achievement in recent years of its existence to be the 13 voice and image of diversified people of Metro 14 Vancouver, have made it a symbol to follow for future 15 and the channel's very unique values have made the 16 members of the region's ethnocultural communities very 17 proud and happy to have this service. 18 236 The public support for the 19 continuation of this basic cable service which proved 20 and improved itself in quality and variety over the 21 years, and especially with the launch of RMC new weekly 22 schedule is starting the fall of '98 providing quality 23 programming for variety of viewers' age and interests, 24 has never been so loud and clear. 25 237 I believe the channel should be StenoTran 63 1 adequately funded and the imposed restrictions for 2 advertising as the only source of funding for the 3 program suppliers and also the channel, should be 4 minimized, if not lifted. 5 238 I strongly suggest that there must be 6 a priority on the development of Canadian ethnocultural 7 services presenting quality programming with Canadian 8 made content to their respective audiences and the 9 importance of foreign services, especially those 10 originated or coming from American providers should be 11 restricted in this country. We already have more than 12 enough. We already have more than enough share of 13 American-based channels and programming in Canada. 14 239 If this country ever wished to be 15 culturally independent and Canada holds to its 16 worldwide image of being a true diversified 17 multicultural country, welcoming the new or different 18 ideas of people around the globe, who decide to call 19 this great land their home, we have to come up with our 20 own cultural tools, which means like television systems 21 to make this wish come true. 22 240 It's always been frustrating for the 23 local broadcasting community, including the Canadian 24 Multicultural program providers and local telecast 25 services to see some of the unlicensed American StenoTran 64 1 satellite services could get access to our small, but 2 lucrative market through a variety of tactics, and they 3 get away with it every time without paying any respect 4 or applicable taxes. 5 241 The illegal U.S. dishes and satellite 6 programming are being smuggled to Canada more than ever 7 now, and there is no policing system to stop or control 8 them effectively. It's a shame for the Federal 9 government of Canada and its regulatory bodies not to 10 being able to control and enforce their own protective 11 regulations against the service providers south of the 12 border whose aggressively trying to absorb revenues by 13 fooling the Canadian audience. 14 242 The need to grant licence for a 15 nationwide multilingual network in Canada with easy 16 affordable access available on basic cable is urgent 17 and immediate. I believe the Canadian broadcasting 18 community and programming providers should be granted 19 more licences to serve the fast-growing multinational 20 population of this county in a much better and easier 21 way, and qualified producers with talent and expertise 22 should have more access to Canadian televised services 23 similar to currently successful Rogers Multicultural 24 Channel. 25 243 Thank you. StenoTran 65 1 244 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 2 much. 3 245 I guess that concludes our first 4 panel. I'd like, in particular, to thank all of you 5 for taking the time to come and assist us in our 6 considerations and making a contribution to the 7 development of our policy and remind you that if 8 anybody has anything to add or elaborate on the 9 presentations today, that we'd welcome any further 10 contributions until the 4th of March. 11 246 Thank you. 12 247 And we will take a 10 minute break. 13 Thank you. 14 --- Recess / Pause 15 1735 16 248 THE CHAIRPERSON: Ladies and 17 gentlemen. Mr. Cardozo...? 18 249 Ladies and gentlemen, the sooner we 19 get going, the sooner we can all get home. 20 250 Madame Secretary, if you could call 21 the next presenters? 22 251 THE SECRETARY: With pleasure, 23 Commissioner Grauer. 24 252 I would like to invite Anup Singh 25 Jubbal to come to the table please, Lilian To, Mobina StenoTran 66 1 Jaffer, Wendy Au, Mason Loh, Albert Lo, Amin Jamal, 2 Patrick Wong and Joe Chan. 3 253 Just sit anywhere there's a 4 microphone. 5 254 And I would invite Anup Singh Jubbal 6 to present first, please. If you just hit the white 7 button on your microphone, please. 8 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 9 255 MR. JUBBAL: Thank you very much to 10 the CRTC Members who are here who has given us the 11 opportunity to come and speak a few words. 12 256 I'm not a great speaker, you know, 13 but I'm too shy to speak. 14 257 I got a few points which I brought 15 with me, I didn't make a long speech of 10 minutes, it 16 may finish in three or four minutes, five minutes, 17 whatever. I want to bring a few points. 18 258 I'd like to bring the point which the 19 Rogers is doing the Community Channel, channel number 20 20, because it is very hard to get even access to the 21 Community Channel 20 to be on the program or bring the 22 views. The producers bring the program, whatever they 23 like to put it. Many things are missing, many things 24 are outside and they never were considered, they never 25 were contacted, if they're contacted they were declined StenoTran 67 1 all the time flatly as there is no ruling or no 2 jurisdiction on it of the CRTC. 3 259 And in my opinion, all the CRTC 4 Community Channel 20 should be accessible to the 5 public; not to just the limited groups or limited 6 number of people. This is my point. And I know I 7 don't blame the producers, they can make the money as 8 much as they can, but they also consider the community 9 at large, what they want. 10 260 Quality of the programs also by 11 Rogers, you know, they have started a program lately 12 which is not at all acceptable by the community the way 13 they give the identification. I mean, if you are 14 showing a story for 20 minutes and then Rogers comes 15 there or advertisers come there, it dies down the whole 16 thing. And I don't know the theme of the story. And 17 then you see the name, the Rogers name there and then 18 it comes back and then the story starts again. 19 261 So this is my concern, not my 20 concern, but the concern of the other community members 21 also. 22 262 The other thing is by the advertising 23 should be shown either in the beginning, Rogers can be 24 shown for 10 minutes in the beginning or 10 minutes at 25 the end, not every half an hour or 10 minutes or 15 StenoTran 68 1 minutes. So this is my concern. 2 263 Community-wise should be heard rather 3 than the producers' own suggestions, which they have 4 the monopoly for the last many, many years. I like to 5 bring that very strongly. 6 264 And the quality of the programs can 7 be improved by the consultation of some of the groups 8 which they should be given a chance to speak and tell 9 how it can be done. If you present the program or send 10 some suggestions, you don't get no response from there, 11 and I don't where the letter goes or how it is treated. 12 265 And we -- this is regarding the 13 Rogers programming, but I'm coming at it on the other 14 Indo-Canadian programming which I belong to, I'm a 15 member of the community, I live here for the last 30 16 years and I know how the system works and so on, and we 17 are looking that if there's some more encouragement on 18 the AM or FM radio station considerations or the 19 24-hour stations to our community. There's no such 20 thing and we'd like to propose and we'll be coming back 21 to you soon on this, too, if we can get something, 22 because most of the time, Chinese, they have three 23 radio stations and we've got a large majority here and 24 we don't have much voice. 25 266 The other things I want to say, we StenoTran 69 1 can restructure the programs which they are going on on 2 the radio stations and the -- we must maintain the 3 cultural identity and pride. I'm Indo-Canadian, so I 4 want to protect my heritage, my identity and my 5 culture. And it's -- we also have the medium of new 6 technology, we must be going with the time as the new 7 technology goes on. 8 267 Multicultural radio is an important 9 link between the new immigrants, people coming from 10 India, they don't have access to many programs, we got 11 a couple of small feeder stations through which 12 whatever they tell us, we hear it. So if we can get 13 some more flexibility in the programs on the mainstream 14 radio stations, it is always helpful to all of us and 15 ethnic broadcasters and high members of the cultural 16 community events must be shown in there. And we must 17 get some... 18 268 There is some program coming from 19 India, one of the producers through feeder station they 20 bring it, it's a good program, some news comes from 21 there, it is really good and some other on the 22 mainstream programs, the programs are available, 23 actually, in India. So that must be brought directly 24 from there so that we can broadcast it, because I heard 25 some of the speakers before me that we shouldn't StenoTran 70 1 encourage -- this is my opinion, but we should 2 encourage because I come from a background and I like 3 to know how the things are going there, how I'm in 4 touch with them all the time so I can identify myself 5 and can get more satisfaction. 6 269 And also, CRTC make the survey on 7 their own, actually, to how they can do it and whatever 8 points I'm bringing, if it's a valid point, they can do 9 independent survey and must consider the points. 10 270 And it's a great learning activity 11 for the new Indo-Canadian Canadians through the radio, 12 through the television, through the media and whatever 13 easy program we can make, you know, we should make. 14 And we must organize the programs, you know, which are 15 respectful and prestigious programs. And we must 16 transfer the knowledge to the best of our knowledge, 17 whatever we can, and community must be consulted before 18 anything can be done. 19 271 I know the broadcasting system is not 20 very economical, there's too much tough competition 21 going on. The producers, the radio stations, the TV 22 stations, they have to make the money. I don't -- I 23 support that part, it must be supported and they must 24 make the money, but at the same time, they must 25 consider the effect and the enjoyment and the StenoTran 71 1 entertainment of the program, because I have seen, you 2 know, sometimes some radio stations, they give the 3 time, mainstream radio station I'm talking about, and 4 they have -- the quality is so poor, every two minutes 5 they have one advertisement, that's not very good. 6 Only we are just learning the -- listening the 7 advertisements, we are not listening to programs. 8 272 And also, many items are being 9 missed. And I think, you know, overall, in conclusion, 10 I would like to say that the programs should be fully 11 culturally oriented. It must have all the points from 12 the illiterate people who are not -- who can't read or 13 write, they must get the full knowledge and 14 understanding of the broadcasting industry and they 15 should get -- so that they should feel, you know, they 16 are sitting at home in this country. 17 273 Thank you very much. 18 274 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 19 much, Mr. Jubbal. 20 275 MR. JUBBAL: Thank you very much. 21 276 THE SECRETARY: Would Lilian To make 22 her presentation now, please? 23 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 24 277 MS TO: Thank you. I appreciate this 25 opportunity to submit to the Canadian Radio-TV and StenoTran 72 1 Telecommunications Commission on broadcasting policy 2 reflecting Canada's linguistic and cultural diversity. 3 278 First of all, I would just like to 4 introduce the organization that I represent, SUCCESS, 5 which has a full name, it's United Chinese Community 6 Enrichment Services Society. It's a non-profit social 7 service agency. We were incorporated in 1993. 8 279 Our primary objective is to build 9 bridges and to assist new Canadians and immigrants to 10 overcome language and cultural barriers and employment 11 barriers and to become participating and contributing 12 members of the Canadian society. 13 280 In 1998, we served more than 230,000 14 clients. We provided services through 10 offices in 15 the Lower Mainland and these services were provided in 16 about 33 different languages and we also enjoy 17 community support, about 44 percent of our funding 18 comes from community voluntary contribution. We have 19 about 16,000 members and 7,000 volunteers who helped us 20 deliver services, together with about 130 staff. 21 281 Because we serve a large number of 22 immigrant and ethnic minority individuals in the 23 community, we are very concerned about the Canadian 24 Ethnic Broadcasting Policy. These policies affect 25 ethnic programming and it also has significant impact, StenoTran 73 1 not only on the issues of accessibility to services, 2 but it also has a real impact on ensuring that there 3 are avenues for full integration in Canadian society. 4 282 A bit of demographic background, and 5 I guess the Commissioners are aware that Canada has 6 become a lot more culturally diverse since it first 7 enacted it's Ethnic Broadcasting Policy, 14 years ago 8 in 1985. And, as you know, it's actually stated in 9 your document that between 1991 and '96, 80 percent of 10 the one million immigrants spoke a language other than 11 English or French. And of course, the 1996 Census 12 shows that visible minorities made up about 11 percent 13 of Canada's population. And talking about the Chinese 14 population, 25.9 percent of the 11 percent were of 15 Chinese origin. And in fact, by year 2006, it was 16 estimated that the proportion of visible minorities in 17 Canada will rise to 16.3 percent. 18 283 According to the 1996 Census, an 19 estimated 310,000 Chinese Canadians lived in British 20 Columbia, and that's about 16 percent of the population 21 of Vancouver. And we believe that currently in 22 Richmond, which is a municipality adjacent to 23 Vancouver, the Chinese population reached about 40 24 percent. 25 284 The Chinese Canadian community's, in StenoTran 74 1 fact, diverse both culturally and linguistically and 2 with immigrants from Hong Kong, Taiwan, China and other 3 South East Asia countries. The significant increase in 4 Mandarin speaking immigrants from Taiwan and China in 5 recent years has post a need for more diverse ethnic 6 programming, even within the Chinese community. 7 285 In view of changing community mix and 8 needs, ethnic programming should be regularly reviewed 9 and adjusted accordingly. 10 286 And now, I would like to talk a bit 11 about the relevance of Ethnic Broadcasting Policy. 12 Again, it was stated in your document as our technology 13 advances with possibilities of digital broadcasting, 14 satellites, Internet, chat rooms and many other media 15 channels, CRTC must recognize that not all communities 16 are equally accessible to computers or computer 17 literacy. And of course, on the one hand, 18 accessibility to emerging technologies should be 19 considered a priority to meet the needs of ethnic 20 minorities. 21 287 On the other hand, however, ethnic 22 broadcasting policies must be in place to ensure that 23 there's availability of ethnocultural services, and 24 also, it should provide an adequate Canadian 25 broadcasting system which serves the needs of all StenoTran 75 1 Canadians in the ethnoculturally diverse society. 2 288 We definitely support the delivery of 3 ethnocultural programming by different vehicles. We 4 want to ensure that ethnocultural programming is 5 accessible to all the communities and some of these 6 vehicles, again, as listed should include certain 7 language specialty services and ethnocultural 8 programming available through community channels, other 9 cable companies, special programming and so on. 10 289 And I cannot stress more on the 11 importance of policy priorities to ensure that all of 12 our over-the-air broadcasters do reflect the 13 ethnocultural diversities in the communities that they 14 serve. 15 290 I realize that we missed the Hearing 16 last year on the mainstream -- so-called mainstream 17 broadcasting, but it is very important, I think it 18 is -- one of the presenters mentioned earlier that 19 there's often been negative and sensational reporting 20 in the mainstream broadcasting channels, and the other 21 kind of reporting that they make is on festivities. We 22 are hoping that there will be improvement on all the 23 other over-the-air broadcasters so that they will be 24 reflecting what is happening in the ethnocultural 25 communities that we live in and which is actually part StenoTran 76 1 of the whole Canadian society. 2 291 When we talk about integration of 3 Canadians, it is very important to remember that when 4 we talk about ethnocultural broadcasting policy to 5 reach these communities, it's very important to also 6 prepare the other side, the so-called "mainstream 7 community", so that they will fully accept the 8 ethnocultural community in terms of integrating in 9 employment and other areas. So the public broadcasting 10 in the mainstream community is very important in being 11 able to address these concerns. 12 292 The other issue that I want to 13 address is about diversity in ethnic programming. 14 293 A person, ethnic programming for 15 Chinese Canadians is provided mainly through Type A 16 programs as documented in your document. And these are 17 often done through ethnic broadcast stations. 18 294 There's mention about Type C, D and E 19 programs, which targets second or third generation 20 Canadians and which attempt to promote multiculturalism 21 in English or French. These are rare in the Chinese 22 community and we find that maybe some of these, maybe, 23 should be promoted to foster cultural heritage and to 24 build cross-cultural understanding. 25 295 We do support placing priority on StenoTran 77 1 domestic production of ethnocultural services in order 2 to transmit Canadian values to ethnocultural groups, 3 and certainly, this is very important. And we believe 4 that ethnic broadcasters and producers should be given 5 the same resources and support for domestic production, 6 which may provide additional export potential. 7 296 However, we feel that there is a role 8 for some imported television broadcast, especially as 9 it relates to international trade and news and culture, 10 which balance quality Canadian content. 11 297 Third language broadcasting allows 12 Canadians, especially those with language barriers, to 13 acquire information, to be familiarized with Canadian 14 values and issues and to engage in participating in the 15 Canadian society, while at the same time it enables 16 them to develop international connections and retain 17 the language of their country of origin. 18 298 In this new era of globalization in 19 trade and cultural exchange, third language programming 20 should be retained and encouraged to facilitate 21 integration in Canadian society and that should be 22 balanced with quality Canadian programming content. 23 299 The other issue I wish to talk about 24 is briefly on service accessibility. 25 300 The provision of current services in StenoTran 78 1 ethnic programming has not been able to reach 2 geographically isolated communities and those who have 3 difficulty paying the subscription fees and there's 4 some other communities that have not been able to 5 access ethnic programming. Public support to ethnic 6 programming should be provided for those who lack 7 sufficient resources. 8 301 And the last point to talk about, an 9 advisory body, I think that somebody -- presenter 10 mentioned before. We do recommend the establishment of 11 an ethnic advisory group to monitor and advise the CRTC 12 on ethnic policies. And hopefully that would help give 13 kind of balanced programming on a continuous basis. 14 302 I appreciate this opportunity to 15 review the Ethnic Broadcasting Policy and we believe 16 that linguistic and ethnic diversity in broadcasting is 17 crucial in building a fair and harmonious society. And 18 definitely the current system requires revision to 19 ensure the removal of barriers and full access for 20 ethnic and linguistic minorities. 21 303 Thank you. 22 304 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Ms To. 23 305 THE SECRETARY: I'd like to invite 24 Mobina Jaffer to make her presentation now. 25 1800 StenoTran 79 1 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 2 306 MS JAFFER: Members of the 3 Commission, I'm Mobina Jaffer. I am the President of 4 the YWCA and I'd like to thank you for this opportunity 5 of being able to speak to you here today. 6 307 The 1985 Ethnic Broadcasting Policy 7 was designed to ensure that members of ethnocultural 8 groups in Canada would have access to a range of 9 programming in third languages from a variety of 10 sources, including high quality Canadian programming in 11 third languages from Canadian ethnic broadcasting 12 services. 13 308 I would like to emphasize "high 14 quality", it's my organization and my belief that the 15 CRTC has a mandate and there is the law of our land, 16 the Multicultural Act, which it also has to look at in 17 order to achieve harmony in our country, and by helping 18 with integration. 19 309 If we look at the environment today, 20 there is the mainstream broadcasting, foreign services 21 and a little bit of ethnic Canadian broadcasting. We 22 need, and you heard very eloquently from Ms Dhaliwal, 23 high quality accessible broadcasting. The big question 24 is, as in your press release accompanying the Public 25 Notice, the Commission asked whether "...Priority StenoTran 80 1 should be placed on Canadian ethnic broadcasting 2 services, rather than importing foreign services?" 3 310 Let me explain what that means. 4 Foreign programming in third languages is an important 5 source of entertainment for members of ethnocultural 6 groups. It provides a valuable link to current events 7 in homeland countries and to cultural traditions. In 8 my own case, before I came to this country and became a 9 Canadian citizen, I was a British subject, and 10 therefore, I enjoy, as entertainment watching "On the 11 Buses" or "Are You Being Served?". That is good for 12 entertainment, but that doesn't meet my needs as a new 13 Canadian. 14 311 Foreign programming is not a 15 substitute for Canadian programming in third languages. 16 Foreign programming does not reflect the reality of 17 life in Canada. It often presents information, conveys 18 values or addresses social issues in ways that are 19 fundamentally at odds with how things are done in 20 Canada. 21 312 Let me give you another example. 22 Some years ago, as you may remember, we had a large 23 AIDS conference here in Vancouver, and very naively, I 24 did not realize that the South Asian community has an 25 AIDS problem. I happened to be in Toronto and watched StenoTran 81 1 CFMT and the AIDS program and was shocked to see that 2 AIDS exist in the South Asian community. Now, as a 3 mother, that's an issue for me that I never even 4 thought about discussing with my children, because I 5 always see images of mainstream people having AIDS. 6 313 This is necessary for my family, for 7 myself, for education purposes that we see our faces in 8 the media which is a very strong -- especially the TV 9 media, a very strong reflection of who we are. 10 314 Canadian programming in third 11 languages provides members of ethnocultural groups with 12 information about their local community and about 13 Canada. It is essential to facilitate integration and 14 to ensure that everyone has an opportunity to 15 participate in Canadian society. 16 315 Let me give you another example. I 17 come from a South Asian background, and "arranged 18 marriages" is my life's reality. When I was in Toronto 19 and I saw the program on arranged marriages that was on 20 CFMT, I was envious and here we in Vancouver tend to 21 think everything goes to Toronto, but the reality is, 22 when it comes to programming such as that, everything 23 has gone to Toronto. And we, in Vancouver, are denied 24 our issues being discussed. 25 316 This arranged marriage program that StenoTran 82 1 was on CFMT discussed it from both points of view. 2 Normally what we see in mainstream media is where 3 arranged marriages is being criticized; here, it was an 4 issue of choice. I felt that my children were being 5 denied looking at programs of this nature. 6 317 The Ethnic Broadcasting Policy 7 anticipates that members of ethnocultural groups will 8 have access to a range of Canadian programming in third 9 languages provided on community access channels on 10 cable, on over-the-air radio and television stations 11 and on Specialty and Pay television services. It is 12 important that this range of programming be available, 13 not just so that members of ethnocultural groups have 14 the same choice as English and French speaking 15 Canadians, but they also have access to the same 16 diversity of opinions and ideas. 17 318 Statutory support for the Ethnic 18 Broadcasting Policy is found in the broadcasting policy 19 objectives of the Act. For example, section 3 (d) 20 (iii) states that: 21 "...programming provided by the 22 Canadian broadcasting system 23 should reflect the multicultural 24 and multiracial nature of 25 Canadian society." StenoTran 83 1 319 I would ask that you ask yourself: 2 Is the ethnocultural community being served presently 3 with what exists, especially here in our city? 4 320 The Ethnic Broadcasting Policy also 5 is supported by the Multiculturalism Policy of which I 6 spoke of earlier. That policy envisions a 7 multicultural Canada in which all people can fully and 8 equally participate in the life of this country while 9 retaining their cultural heritage. 10 321 Simply put, I believe that the 11 fundamental objective of the Ethnic Broadcasting Policy 12 should be to promote social harmony and integration. 13 Now that the Ethnic Broadcasting Policy has been in 14 place for 15 years, I believe that it is timely for the 15 Commission to ask: "Are the objectives of the Ethnic 16 Broadcasting Policy being achieved? Is the potential 17 for the Canadian broadcasting system to promote social 18 harmony being realized?" 19 322 And I think when you answer these 20 questions, you have no other thing -- no other answer 21 but to say "no". 22 323 English language broadcasting 23 services have made some effort to reflect Canada's 24 multicultural nature in the faces of the people on the 25 television screen and in the names and voices of the StenoTran 84 1 people on radio. But there is still very little 2 coverage or very little ethnocultural content on 3 mainstream broadcasting services. There is little 4 coverage of events and issues in local ethnocultural 5 communities, and little effort to bring ethnocultural 6 perspectives to bear on broader local or national 7 issues. 8 324 The objectives of the Ethnic 9 Broadcasting Policy will not be achieved until the 10 programming provided by mainstream broadcasting 11 services is truly inclusive of all people who make up 12 the community. 13 325 It is very interesting being from a 14 minority to see at the present time the Heritage 15 Minister fighting for Canadian content in magazines. I 16 ask her and I ask you: What about us? Canadian 17 content on television to reflect the new Canada that we 18 all live in? 19 326 And what does "inclusive" mean? 20 "Inclusive" does not mean a peppering or one anchor 21 person who looks like me. "Inclusive" means to be on 22 the floor when the programs are being decided. 23 "Inclusive" means to be included when decisions are 24 made of what kind of content the programs will have, 25 and "inclusive" means more than one anchor person that StenoTran 85 1 reflects a person like me. 2 327 Yes, fortunately for some people, not 3 in Vancouver, there are, for example, in Toronto and 4 Montreal, members of the ethnocultural groups who do 5 have access to a balanced and diverse selection of 6 Canadian programming in third languages. In other 7 markets that is the case, but sadly that is not the 8 case in Vancouver. Until that changes, it cannot be 9 said that the objectives of the Ethnic Broadcasting 10 Policy are being achieved. 11 328 As I mentioned earlier, this is also 12 the issue of quality. What is "quality"? You heard 13 from Ms Dhaliwal, over-the-air high quality television. 14 This is very important, and let me try and give you an 15 example. 16 329 My friends who are from the 17 mainstream community and who have permission to be able 18 to tell me things that maybe some others who don't know 19 me as well can, often say to me, you know, that when 20 they watch multicultural television they often hear a 21 whining and they find way poor quality television. And 22 I try and explain to them that that is because 23 multicultural television is like community television, 24 and when mainstream people are watching community 25 television, there is a switch in the brain to say, StenoTran 86 1 "Well, this is community television, it's not 2 commercial, perhaps it's not as high quality". 3 330 But sadly, I don't believe the switch 4 happens when it comes to multicultural television. We, 5 as a people, are seen as inferior because the kind of 6 programming that is being produced and it has got 7 nothing to do with the people who are producing it. 8 That's not what I'm talking about. It's the resources 9 that are available to them. 10 331 We as a community, we as a 11 multicultural community are seen as inferior. That 12 doesn't lead to good integration. 13 332 There is an important role to be 14 played by programming in third languages produced by 15 volunteers on community access channels, and I am not 16 being critical of what they do, I believe they do an 17 excellent job with the resources they have available. 18 That programming provides opportunities for members of 19 ethnocultural groups to gain experience in program 20 production and also ensures some basic level of service 21 for members of very small ethnocultural groups. There 22 is also a role for lower cost, imported foreign 23 programming, on mainstream television stations or on 24 Specialty services. 25 333 But members of my group are not StenoTran 87 1 well-served if that is the only type of third language 2 programming that is available. In addition, we must 3 remember that broadcasting is a powerful force in 4 shaping people's perceptions. If third language 5 programming is always of poorer quality, that will 6 negatively influence how members of ethnocultural 7 groups are perceived by other Canadians. 8 334 The Ethnic Broadcasting Policy 9 anticipates that there will be a range of third 10 language programming available, including high quality, 11 advertiser-supported Canadian programming broadcast in 12 prime time on local multilingual television stations. 13 335 I believe that the Canadian 14 broadcasting system will not reach its full potential 15 to promote harmony, nor will the objectives of the 16 Ethnic Broadcasting Policy be achieved until members of 17 the ethnocultural groups have access to a full 18 selection of the highest quality programming in third 19 languages, comparable to that available on French and 20 English language broadcast media. 21 336 The new Millennium means many 22 different things to many different people. I believe 23 that it could be an era of true social harmony, where 24 people live as equals in an increasingly diverse and 25 multicultural Canada. I believe that the Canadian StenoTran 88 1 broadcasting system and the Ethnic Broadcasting Policy 2 have a very critical, important role to play in helping 3 to create social harmony. 4 337 I believe that many times you have, 5 in your hands, how my children and my grandchildren 6 will be viewed. As equal or as second-class citizens. 7 338 The implementation of the Ethnic 8 Broadcasting Policy is a bit like playing the piano. A 9 piano has white keys and black keys. And each key, as 10 you know, can be played on its own, and you can get 11 some kind of harmony if you only play on the black 12 keys; and you can get some kind of harmony if you play 13 only on the black keys -- white keys. But I ask you, 14 when you're looking at your policies, to stop just 15 having us play only on the white keys and a few black 16 keys; the time has arrived when you need to play both 17 on the black and white keys. 18 339 Thank you. 19 340 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 20 much, Ms Jaffer. 21 341 THE SECRETARY: Our next presenter is 22 Wendy Au. 23 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 24 342 MS AU: Good evening. I'd like to 25 thank the Commissioners for the opportunity to speak as StenoTran 89 1 an interested member of the public on this very 2 important issue of broadcasting policy relating to 3 Canadian cultural diversity. 4 343 My name is Wendy Au, and I'm a first 5 generation Chinese Canadian and a Vancouver resident 6 for 26 years. I'm not involved in the broadcasting 7 industry, and I'm here to speak more from my experience 8 and observations from working with the multicultural 9 communities over a long period of time. 10 344 I have been involved in community 11 development work with the multicultural communities on 12 both a voluntary and professional basis. My 13 professional experiences include being the community 14 school coordinator, an executive director of a 15 community centre, an equal employment opportunity 16 program officer, and a diversity trainer. Presently, 17 I'm a social planner focusing on the development and 18 growth of the multicultural communities in Vancouver. 19 345 I am pleased to learn that the 20 Broadcasting Act establishes a number of broadcasting 21 policy objectives, and particulary in section 3, where 22 it states that: 23 "the Canadian broadcasting 24 system should serve to 25 safeguard, enrich and strengthen StenoTran 90 1 the cultural, political, social 2 and economic fabric of Canada." 3 346 This broadcasting policy objective 4 fits perfectly within the context of Canada's official 5 policy on multiculturalism, which envisions a 6 multicultural Canada in which all people can fully 7 participate in the life of this country while retaining 8 a connection to their cultural heritage. Therefore, it 9 is critical that the Canadian Ethnic Broadcasting 10 Policy ensure the availability of radio and television 11 programming in languages other than English or French. 12 347 I'd like to focus my presentation 13 today on the "social mandate" of the broadcasting 14 system and, specifically, to review the contribution of 15 the Ethnic Broadcasting Policy to the social fabric of 16 Canada. If the Ethnic Broadcasting Policy is 17 effective, it is a tool to strengthen the social fabric 18 of Canada. 19 Bridging Function 20 348 An effective Ethnic Broadcasting 21 Policy will help to build bridges of understanding and 22 acceptance between ethnic communities groups and other 23 Canadians; as well as within ethnic communities. 24 349 I am concerned that the "bridging" 25 between and within communities is not happening to the StenoTran 91 1 extent that they could be and should be. 2 350 Therefore, the objectives of the 3 Ethnic Broadcasting Policy are not being fully 4 achieved. 5 351 Let us explore some of the reasons 6 why the "bridging" are not functioning as well as it 7 should be. 8 Ethnocultural Content in the English Broadcasting 9 System 10 352 There's currently a lack a 11 ethnocultural content in the English language 12 broadcasting media. 13 353 English language media do not seem to 14 have the interest or the ability to cover issues and 15 events happening in the ethnocultural communities. 16 354 Most of the programming content does 17 not reflect the multicultural make up of the community. 18 355 When ethnocultural communities are 19 covered, it is most often negative; there are either 20 sensational crime stories of drugs and murder involving 21 members of the local ethnocultural groups, or stories 22 about particular refugee groups trying to defraud the 23 welfare system. Positive contributions or good stories 24 have difficulty gathering attention from the English 25 language media or the mainstream media, so-called. StenoTran 92 1 356 If English broadcasters are to 2 perform a bridging function, they must go beyond merely 3 visual "reflection" of having visible minority staff in 4 front of a camera, but with no program content that is 5 relevant to the multicultural community. 6 357 English language media must actively 7 facilitate cross-cultural understanding by including 8 information and perspectives in their programs that 9 reflect "all" Canadians, all local Canadian experiences 10 in an inclusive and equitable manner. 11 Canadian Programming in Third Languages 12 358 Canadian programming in third 13 languages is essential to provide members of 14 ethnocultural groups with information about their local 15 community and Canada, to facilitate integration and to 16 ensure that everyone has an opportunity to participate 17 in Canadian society. 18 359 Canadian produced programs in third 19 languages media, particularly on television, are very 20 often over-shadowed by imported foreign videos and 21 film. 22 360 Foreign programming does provide 23 members of ethnocultural groups with cultural and 24 information linkages to their home country. However, 25 it also risks reinforcement of negative stereotypes, StenoTran 93 1 traditions, and values from the home country which may 2 be contrary to the values of Canadian society. 3 361 For example, the portrayal of women 4 in a subservient role will no doubt reinforce 5 inequality among men and women, which may lead to 6 family violence. While the use of imposed force and 7 authority by parents may promote parent-child 8 conflicts, as well as perceived child abuse by Canadian 9 authorities. 10 362 Foreign programming also may not deal 11 with potentially controversial issues, such as sexual 12 orientation and other human rights issues, in a way 13 that reflects the present Canadian legal and social 14 environment. 15 363 Imported foreign films can never 16 replace the value of locally produced programs with 17 relevant Canadian content. Although we appreciate the 18 cultural connection with our homeland, it is also 19 necessary to balance this with the need for relevant 20 local Canadian content which will help us to understand 21 and establish ourselves in this new homeland. And I 22 suspect this is one of the reasons why the CRTC, in 23 your wisdom, has created the Ethnic Broadcasting 24 Policy. 25 364 To be effective, the Ethnic StenoTran 94 1 Broadcasting Policy must ensure that members of 2 ethnocultural groups have access to Canadian 3 programming in third languages that provides 4 information about the local community in Canada, 5 information that enhances understanding of Canadian 6 values and which facilitates smooth integration into 7 Canadian society. 8 365 I'm concerned that in Vancouver, 9 there is a serious lack of Canadian programming in 10 third languages and therefore, the social mandate of 11 the broadcasting system in this city is not being met. 12 Access 13 366 Having a social mandate and social 14 responsibility also means that the operation of the 15 broadcasting system cannot be governed solely by market 16 forces. 17 367 A complete reliance on market forces 18 will mean that many ethnic groups are forced to pay for 19 information in their own language. Especially for 20 smaller ethnocultural groups with limited economic 21 resources, they are deprived of vital information on 22 issues in their local community and Canada as a whole. 23 368 For many recently arrived immigrants 24 and refugees, the first few years of transition and 25 settlement can be very difficult, especially if they StenoTran 95 1 are very limited English language skills. They do 2 rely, to a large extent, on obtaining community 3 information and news via third language media. This 4 serves as a vital tool in their integration process. 5 369 A communication link in their mother 6 tongue is necessary to assist in the settlement and 7 integration. A recent survey of the Vietnamese 8 community confirmed that a large proportion of 9 Vietnamese residents have limited English language, and 10 they preferred to receive information on community 11 services and programs via broadcasting media in their 12 own language instead of printed information. 13 370 The limited access to radio and 14 television programming by some ethnocultural groups has 15 been a constant challenge and struggle. Most of these 16 local programs are produced by the ethnocultural groups 17 on a volunteer basis with virtually no resources and 18 limited technical support. 19 371 Members of the ethnocultural groups 20 are not well served by the broadcasting system if the 21 only ethnic programming available to them is of less 22 than full "broadcast" quality. The ethnocultural 23 communities would therefore continue to be presented as 24 the inferior groups or second rate citizens within the 25 broader community, which will, in turn, reinforce StenoTran 96 1 negative stereotypes of ethnocultural community groups. 2 372 Free access to Canadian third 3 language radio and television programming for as many 4 ethnocultural groups as possible, especially the 5 smaller ones, should remain a fundamental principle of 6 the Canadian Ethnic Broadcasting Policy. 7 373 This principle must be maintained by 8 the CRTC if the Ethnic Broadcasting Policy is to fulfil 9 its social mandate. 10 Recommendations 11 374 In closing, I would like to put 12 forward the following recommendations: 13 375 As a result of this policy review, 14 the CRTC should take steps to ensure that the social 15 mandate of the broadcasting system is being fulfilled 16 by (a) encouraging English language broadcasters to 17 reflect "all" local Canadian experiences in an 18 inclusive and equitable manner; (b) increasing the 19 availability of Canadian third language programming; 20 (c) encouraging and ensuring that third language 21 programming has adequate support to develop quality 22 local Canadian programs; (d) ensuring free access to 23 Canadian radio and television programming for as many 24 ethnocultural groups as possible; and, finally, (e) 25 developing an effective means to monitor and evaluate StenoTran 97 1 the social mandate of both English language and third 2 languages media. 3 376 The comparative material released by 4 the CRTC shows that in Toronto and Montreal, members of 5 ethnocultural groups have access to free Canadian third 6 language programming provided by a local multilingual 7 television station; such a station in Vancouver could 8 address some of the principle concerns expressed in 9 this presentation. 10 377 Thank you very much for the 11 opportunity to present my viewpoints and for taking 12 time to review the effectiveness of the Ethnic 13 Broadcasting Policy. 14 378 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 15 much, Ms Au. 16 379 THE SECRETARY: Our next presenter 17 this evening is Mason Loh. 18 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 19 380 MR. LOH: Thank you, Honourable 20 Commissioners. It's my pleasure to appear before you 21 today at this consultation. I'm appearing as an 22 interested member of the public. 23 381 Although I am a lawyer by occupation, 24 I work as a volunteer in the community, but more 25 relevant to all of this is I'm a consumer of ethnic StenoTran 98 1 language programming, TV and radio. And according to 2 the 1996 Statistics Canada Census, I guess over 300,000 3 of our population here in Vancouver speak at least one 4 of the foreign languages, third languages we're talking 5 about here, at home. So I presume the market is at 6 least that big and that number is two or three years 7 old. So I'm within that number and I resort to ethnic 8 language programming very much on my sources as a 9 source of information and also entertainment, too. 10 382 Now, I propose to briefly respond to 11 the three questions set out in your News Release 12 accompanying the Public Notice. 13 383 To Question Number 1: 14 "To what extent does the present 15 broadcasting system adequately 16 serve Canada's ethnocultural 17 communities?" 18 384 The Ethnic Broadcasting Policy 19 provides an effective policy and regulatory framework 20 to ensure that the needs and interests of members of 21 ethnocultural groups in Canada are served by the 22 Canadian broadcasting system. 23 385 The Ethnic Broadcasting Policy: 24 "(i) requires Canadian radio and 25 television broadcasters to StenoTran 99 1 reflect the multicultural nature 2 of Canadian society in the 3 programming that they provide; 4 (ii) supports the provision of 5 Canadian television and radio 6 programming in languages other 7 than English and French, to 8 facilitate integration and equal 9 participation in Canadian 10 society by members of 11 ethnocultural groups; and (iii) 12 allows for access to foreign 13 programming in third languages, 14 to provide members of 15 ethnocultural groups with 16 increased choice and diversity 17 of international information and 18 entertainment programming; and, 19 lastly, (iv) creates 20 opportunities for members of 21 ethnocultural groups to actively 22 participate in the Canadian 23 broadcasting system in languages 24 other than English or French, as 25 the creators of programming, as StenoTran 100 1 the employees, managers or 2 owners of broadcasting services, 3 or as the purchasers of 4 advertising." 5 386 Now, it's been almost 15 years since 6 the policy was first established, but the ethnic 7 policy, I believe, is still relevant and it's still 8 strong. 9 387 If the present broadcasting system is 10 not adequately serving Canada's ethnocultural 11 communities, the problem is not the policy but rather, 12 the implementation of the policy. 13 388 Now, on to the second question you've 14 posed: 15 "Given the demographic changes 16 that have taken place in Canada, 17 how can the needs and interests 18 of ethnocultural communities 19 continue to be served?" 20 389 There certainly have been significant 21 changes in the population of Canada in the last 14 22 years and some of the earlier presenters have already 23 touched upon that. In the Vancouver area, particularly 24 relevant for us here and for the community that I come 25 from, the Chinese speaking community, over 200,000 StenoTran 101 1 people now identify themselves as speaking Chinese 2 language at home as their primary language, being the 3 largest group here in Vancouver. 4 390 Now with these changes in demography, 5 I believe they're placing new demands on the Canadian 6 broadcasting system. It is a good time to review the 7 implementation of the policy to ensure that it is 8 keeping pace with demands. I applaud the Commission 9 for doing this circuit and consulting the community on 10 it. 11 391 Some of the questions that I would 12 ask is: If there is a growing ethnic population and 13 there is more demand for programming in third 14 languages, is that demand being met by this policy? 15 392 The second question: Consumers also 16 are demanding more choice and diversity in third 17 language programming, higher quality and more local and 18 Canadian information programming; is that demand being 19 met? 20 393 Thirdly: Advertisers want greater 21 choice and more ways to reach their customers in third 22 languages; is that demand being met? 23 394 Fourthly: Members of ethnocultural 24 groups are looking for more opportunities to become 25 involved in the creative and business sides of the StenoTran 102 1 Canadian broadcasting industry; is that demand being 2 met? 3 395 The comparative data released by the 4 CRTC show that some markets are better served than 5 other markets; in some markets, the new demands are 6 being met, in other markets they may not be. 7 396 For example, if we compare the 8 Chinese community population in Vancouver to Toronto, 9 we're slightly smaller here, but we are much bigger 10 than the Chinese community in Montreal. But in both 11 Toronto and Montreal, Chinese speaking viewers have 12 access to free local television programming in Chinese 13 languages and other languages. And the local 14 businesses can use broadcast television to reach their 15 customers with advertising in Chinese languages; but 16 here in Vancouver, that is still not yet the case. 17 397 Now, this review by the Commission is 18 an important opportunity for the Commission to evaluate 19 the implementation of its Ethnic Broadcasting Policy to 20 identify demands that are not being met, and to chart a 21 course of action to ensure that the structure of the 22 Canadian broadcasting system keeps pace with Canada's 23 changing demography. 24 398 Now, the last question, the third 25 question you've posed is: StenoTran 103 1 "Should there be a priority on 2 the development of Canadian 3 ethnocultural services other 4 than importing foreign 5 services?" 6 399 Foreign third language services 7 provide members of ethnocultural groups with increased 8 viewing choices, just like U.S. programming services in 9 English provide English Canadians with increased 10 viewing choice. 11 400 However, foreign services are not a 12 substitute for Canadian services. 13 401 Members of ethnocultural groups need 14 Canadian third language programming to learn more about 15 Canada and to develop a sense of Canada as their own 16 country. 17 402 Canadian third language programming 18 facilitates integration, promotes equal participation 19 and ensures that members of ethnocultural groups have 20 access to a Canadian perspective on local, national and 21 international events and issues. 22 403 Canadian third language programming 23 also provides members of ethnocultural groups with an 24 opportunity to contribute their views and unique 25 perspective on Canadian society and to actively StenoTran 104 1 participate in the creative and business sides of the 2 Canadian broadcasting industry. 3 404 In ethnic broadcasting, as in other 4 areas of the Canadian broadcasting system, the 5 Commission should assign the highest priority to 6 Canadian ethnic broadcasting services that provide 7 Canadian programming in third languages, while, at the 8 same time allowing viewers to have access to foreign 9 services and foreign programming. 10 405 So, in conclusion, I guess you can 11 gather from me, as just one single consumer of third 12 language programming, that I like choices, just like 13 any of us if we're buying anything, we like to have 14 choices on pricing, on quality, on selection. I think 15 it's a basic demand and I urge you to consider that in 16 your review of the policy. 17 406 Thank you. 18 407 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Mr. Loh. 19 408 THE SECRETARY: Mr. Loh, before you 20 relax entirely, did I introduce you as Manson Loh? 21 409 MR. LOH: Yes, I think so... 22 410 THE SECRETARY: I am sorry for that. 23 Can the record reflect that this was Mason Loh. 24 411 MR. LOH: Thank you. 25 412 THE SECRETARY: Thanks very much. StenoTran 105 1 413 MR. LOH: Thank you, ma'am. 2 1830 3 414 THE SECRETARY: And our next 4 presenter this evening is Albert Lo. 5 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 6 415 MR. LO: My name is Albert Lo, I'm 7 the Vice President of a non-profit society called The 8 Agape Christian Team of Canada. 9 416 For some eight years, together with 10 the Chinese Committee Television Limited, we have 11 co-produced a lifestyle and culture program in the 12 Chinese language which is called "Vision Agape". This 13 local production was telecast continuously for almost 14 eight years on the multicultural channel here in 15 Vancouver until last September when it was arbitrarily 16 banned by the licensed service provider. 17 417 Today I'm here to offer some comments 18 in response to the Public Notice CRTC 1998-135 with 19 regard to the broadcasting policy reflecting Canada's 20 linguistic and cultural diversity. 21 418 Paragraph 9 of the Public Notice 22 makes reference to, and I quote: 23 "It is the Commission's 24 objective to ensure that its 25 policy, as modified by whatever StenoTran 106 1 changes it may determine are 2 necessary, continues to provide 3 an adequate framework within 4 which the Canadian broadcasting 5 system may serve the needs and 6 interests of all Canadians by 7 reflecting their ethnocultural 8 diversity in an effective 9 manner." 10 419 From our experience and viewers' 11 feedback over the years, we would say that the 12 Commission's policy had been reasonably effective up 13 until 1998. Public feedback also tells us that 14 beginning sometime last year, the needs and interests 15 of a significant and particular segment of Canadians 16 ceased being served and their ethnocultural diversity 17 stopped being respected. 18 420 The exact cause of this phenomenon is 19 yet to be determined. However, anecdotal evidence and 20 our actual experience both suggest that the 21 Commission's policy is basically sound, although 22 there's always room for improvement. Nevertheless, we 23 are of the opinion that there's a weakness in terms of 24 fulfilling the intent and spirit of the policy, and 25 that is implementation as alluded to by our previous StenoTran 107 1 presenter that I heard. 2 421 Without digressing or getting into 3 specific barriers that we ourselves encountered with 4 certain licensee, as this is not the proper forum for 5 such discussions, we would like to highlight the 6 following points for consideration by the Commission: 7 422 1) A broadcasting policy reflecting 8 Canada's linguistic and cultural diversity is a noble 9 policy. Its success would make for a more harmonious 10 and united Canada, provided all the stakeholders and 11 players support the policy by living up to its intent 12 and spirit and not merely comply in a technical sense. 13 423 2) We believe a policy that reflects 14 Canada's linguistic and cultural diversity includes the 15 concept of respect. This obviates the vital importance 16 of providing programming that promotes cross-cultural 17 understanding when viewed from a policy framework 18 perspective. 19 424 3) Ethnic broadcasting is more than 20 just a purely commercial venture. The societal 21 obligation of serving the needs of the ethnocultural 22 communities must be brought into sharp focus in 23 examining licensing framework. A licensed to provide 24 ethnic programming in a semi-monopolistic, if not 25 totally monopolistic fashion, is a privilege that StenoTran 108 1 carries with it a certain public trust. Licensees must 2 therefore be held accountable at all times in terms of 3 fulfilling policy requirements, not just at licence 4 renewal times. 5 425 4) To enhance the policy's 6 effectiveness, there should be provision for incentives 7 to those service providers who have conscientiously 8 supported and upheld the policy, as well as living up 9 to and fulfilled in good faith, all of the conditions 10 of their applicable licences. 11 426 5) The ethic broadcasting regulatory 12 regime -- and I refer to paragraph 17 -- to paragraph 13 27 of the Public Notice, should also include some 14 provisions for these incentives to prevent and minimize 15 the possibility of potential for any interested party 16 to profit by way of playing politics of division or by 17 promoting ethnic bribery while hiding behind some 18 clever politics of appearance. In the absence of 19 safeguards to keep this type of politics to a minimum, 20 there's a real potential for any unscrupulous players 21 in ethnic broadcasting to cause irreparable harm to 22 ethnic relations and racial harmony because of pure 23 greed or because of their own private agenda. 24 427 Finally, enforcement is an aspect 25 that should be taken into consideration in any policy StenoTran 109 1 we design. Without any effective enforcement 2 mechanism, a policy is just like a paper tiger. With 3 no teeth, it is not worth the paper it is written on. 4 428 In this regard, I must say it is a 5 pleasant surprise to learn of a recommendation that was 6 made earlier by the presenter from AMSSA, a 7 recommendation that we, too, would like the Commission 8 to consider. And that is to establish an independent 9 objective body with the responsibility of monitoring, 10 advising and recommending remedial actions in cases of 11 deviations from policy or where complaints arise. 12 429 The body should be comprised of 13 representatives from various ethnic communities who 14 will serve on a volunteer basis. They must also have 15 no arm's length -- non-arm's length relationships with 16 any of the licensees. 17 430 Thank you for the opportunity to 18 present our comments. 19 431 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Mr. Lo. 20 432 THE SECRETARY: I'd like to invite 21 Amin Jamal to present next, please. 22 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 23 433 MR. JAMAL: I thank you very much for 24 giving me the opportunity to present my views. 25 434 My name is Amin Jamal. I am a member StenoTran 110 1 of the South Asian Advisory Board, which is chaired by 2 Mr. Gyan Nath. Since he is in India, I was asked some 3 time last week if I would give my views. Whether these 4 represent Mr. Gyan Nath's views, I don't know, however 5 it is the Board that has the same views, I'm sure. 6 435 And because of this position, I have 7 had the privilege to meet with the managers and people 8 responsible in providing the service in the manner they 9 think fit. 10 436 So nine months ago, the service 11 provider decided to change the way the programs were 12 presented, and this was in the guise of competition. 13 They brought in more inexperienced producers, they paid 14 no attention to the quality and content. Local content 15 was no longer a priority. Those producers that had two 16 to three, and three and a half hour slots were given 17 more like half hour slots at very odd times. People do 18 not have time to phone the response line and we will 19 not complain about something very trivial or small, but 20 the service provider inculcated in people the need to 21 form and unknowingly the producers also encouraged it. 22 Now, the service provider has the ammunition of the big 23 number of complaints about dissatisfaction. 24 437 We are asked if the community was 25 adequately served. The answer is "no". The question StenoTran 111 1 is not how the community can be served well, but why 2 the community is not served well, although the local 3 producers have the facility and the know-how. 4 438 Nine months later, it is time for 5 delivery. You must have received a request for 6 licensing a new channel to serve the community. The 7 answer to this should be that they served the community 8 well until the service provider decided otherwise. 9 439 The question now is whether there is 10 a need for a national channel to serve the community. 11 The logical answer to this is "no". If you look at the 12 demographics, you will find disparity across the 13 nation. The Toronto program must contain 60 percent of 14 Italian programming. The advertisers will not pay more 15 to sell Ragout and pasta to the Chinese community in 16 B.C., and you cannot sell Durian to the Italians. The 17 idea is to sell what people want. 18 440 When I served on the Committee of the 19 Joint Council for the Welfare of Immigrants in England 20 some 25 years ago, an immigrant whose application was 21 being favourably received asked me to withdraw the 22 application. I asked him, "Why do you want to do 23 this?", he said, "I cannot live in a country where 24 they're talking about making homosexuality legal." I 25 said, "What is it to you?", he said, "I want to get out StenoTran 112 1 of here before they make it compulsory." 2 --- Laughter / Rires 3 441 MR. JAMAL: If they will impose a 4 national channel on the community, there will be a 5 revolt. People will look for the alternative source; 6 there is always an alternative. I think the 7 multicultural channel has lost so many viewers the 8 service provider has no idea of the numbers. The 9 satellite dish is becoming more affordable. Before the 10 viewers decide to cancel subscriptions to the basic 11 channels it is time to revert to the old programs. 12 442 Take the example of the change in 13 Coca-Cola recipe. Several years back, the company 14 decided to change the recipe, they lost their 15 marketshare and got hurt badly. Bad enough to bring 16 back the original recipe. They were lucky to win the 17 consumer back since they had a unique product to offer. 18 Why not look at the facts instead of taking chances? 19 443 It is my opinion that the service 20 provider should sit down with the old producers and ask 21 them, "What would be the best way to serve the ethnic 22 community?" 23 444 We had a meeting with the officers of 24 the service provider some 12 days ago. I asked 25 regarding the reason behind the present policy, they StenoTran 113 1 told me they thought the time was right for a change. 2 I asked why there were nine producers of the South 3 Asian language programs? They said because there were 4 that many applications. I asked if they would bring 10 5 more on board? They said if they offered good quality 6 programs. I asked why there was no program in Austrian 7 language? They said because nobody's applied for it. 8 I asked if it were only because the German and the 9 Austrians spoke the same language? The program manager 10 said that the Germans and Austrians spoke different 11 languages. Last week I found out that the German 12 program producer was an Austrian and the person that 13 said the countries spoke different languages happens to 14 be a person of German descent. 15 445 The service provider, evidently, has 16 no interest in serving the community and you have not 17 paid attention to the service provider's disregard to 18 your guidelines. It is my opinion that they should 19 form a committee of ethnic community members to convey 20 the needs and the policy of programming should be based 21 on their recommendations. 22 446 If Murphy's Golden Rule, "One who has 23 gold makes the rules" or a similar German saying, "Wer 24 das gelde hat kann die puppen tanzen lassen" is to be 25 applied, then I rest my case. StenoTran 114 1 447 I thank you very much. 2 448 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you, Mr. 3 Jamal. 4 449 THE SECRETARY: I would invite 5 Patrick Wong and Joe Chan to make their presentations 6 next. 7 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 8 450 MR. CHAN: Madame and Mr. 9 Commissioner, Commission staff and members of the 10 public, I am Joe Chan, General Manager of Fairchild 11 Media Group, and with me today is Patrick Wong, who is 12 the Group's Vice President, Corporate Affairs. 13 451 Fairchild welcomes the opportunity to 14 participate in the Commission's review of third 15 language and Ethnic Broadcasting Policy. We 16 appreciate, in particular, the Commission's efforts to 17 reach out to individuals within the many multicultural 18 communities in Canada and to gain an appreciation of 19 the role ethnic broadcasting plays in the lives of 20 Canadians. 21 452 We believe the current policy has 22 been critical in the development of distinctive 23 Canadian ethnic services and remains a key factor to 24 our success. While we intend to highlight a few of our 25 submissions, we are here today primarily to listen, StenoTran 115 1 along with the Commission, to the perspective of the 2 viewers in this niche we aim to serve. 3 453 The Fairchild Media Group has a 4 significant commitment to ethnic broadcasting with 5 interests in four radio stations, as well as our 6 specialty television services, Fairchild Television and 7 Talentvision. 8 454 Fairchild first entered ethnic radio 9 broadcasting in 1992 when we were issued a licence for 10 CJVB-AM Vancouver. Since then, Fairchild has expanded 11 through the acquisition of an AM station in Toronto and 12 new FM undertakings in Calgary and Vancouver, which we 13 operate in partnership with O.K. Radio Group. In 14 addition, we recently received authority to utilize the 15 SCMO of our Vancouver FM to provide a Korean language 16 service. 17 455 In keeping with the current policy 18 framework, these stations each face the challenge of 19 servicing a wide range of cultural groups in a 20 significant number of different languages. For 21 example, 14 cultural groups in a minimum of 15 22 different languages are served by our Toronto AM 23 station and over 10 cultural groups in 19 different 24 languages by the Calgary FM. In Vancouver we serve 20 25 groups in 15 languages on our FM station, while on the StenoTran 116 1 AM undertaking over 23 cultural community access 2 programming in at least 23 different languages. 3 456 We are proud of the tremendous 4 variety of programming these stations provide to a 5 broad cross section of communities, including 6 Cambodian, Jamaicans, Greeks, Malays, Loasians, 7 Persians, Tamils, Indians, Vietnamese and Koreans. 8 Both through our programming and as a corporate 9 citizen, Fairchild has made a concerted effort to be 10 connected to the communities we serve and in turn, to 11 connect our audience to each other and to other 12 Canadians. 13 457 In this regard, Fairchild established 14 a scholarship at the Ryerson University School of 15 Broadcasting, as well as B.C. Institute of Technology, 16 aimed at expanding the presence of Canadians from a 17 variety of ethnic origins in the media. 18 458 In 1993, we acquired the assets of 19 Chinavision, a national Chinese language specialty 20 undertaking. Today, Fairchild Television continues to 21 serve the Canadian Chinese community, broadcasting 22 primarily in Cantonese. Over 300,000 subscribers 23 currently receive the service via Direct-To-Home 24 satellite or in more limited areas, by MDS or cable. 25 459 In addition to Fairchild Television, StenoTran 117 1 we also operate Talentvision, a regional specialty 2 undertaking acquired in 1993 which serves over 14,000 3 British Columbian subscribers. Talentvision while 4 focuses on the fast-growing Mandarin speaking 5 population also carries programs in Vietnamese and 6 Korean. 7 460 Fairchild Television and Talentvision 8 provide a wide variety of foreign and Canadian 9 programming with news and information produced in our 10 Toronto and Vancouver studios among our most popular 11 shows. We are also pleased to report that 12 increasingly, these Canadian productions are in demand 13 as exports to other countries. Our current affairs 14 program, "Prime Stories" and "Timeline" are now being 15 licensed and shown on the cable network in Hong Kong. 16 461 The following are the issues to 17 consider: Our experience in both television and radio 18 has confirmed the important role ethnic services can 19 play in the Canadian broadcasting system by 20 strengthening the multicultural fabric of our country. 21 We firmly believe there continues to be a need for 22 distinct ethnic policy and that the fine tuning made as 23 part of this review should build on strong framework 24 already in place. 25 462 We appreciate that a public StenoTran 118 1 consultation is not the forum for detailed analysis. 2 We will, therefore, highlight only a few key points. 3 463 On the radio side, Fairchild believes 4 the current ethnic and Canadian content levels remain 5 appropriate and should not be increased. However, 6 licences must be provided with greater flexibility in 7 the scheduling of programs. This flexibility will 8 allow market demand to regulate program schedules while 9 the existing safeguards continue to ensure the quantity 10 and diversity of ethnic programming. 11 464 In television, Fairchild has a number 12 of recommendations. 13 465 First, we believe ethnic services 14 should be afforded the same access to distribution as 15 the Canadian Specialty Services most recently licensed. 16 In other words, upon the earlier of September 1st, '99, 17 or the introduction of digital. 18 466 Fairchild Television continues to 19 struggle to obtain cable distribution. While we are 20 available in Toronto, Vancouver, Edmonton and Calgary, 21 the service is not carried in Montreal, Winnipeg, 22 Ottawa, the Atlantic provinces or in many of the 23 growing communities around Toronto. 24 467 Secondly, Fairchild supports the 25 existing policy which refuses to add a foreign service StenoTran 119 1 to the eligible list, which would be comparative with a 2 Canadian Specialty service. Foreign services bring 3 diversity, but they do not contribute to the financing 4 or broadcast of Canadian programming, nor are they 5 tailored to the specific needs of the people residing 6 here. These continued protection is vital to the 7 growth of distinctive Canadian ethnic programming. 8 468 Finally, Fairchild does not believe 9 the licensing of a national ethnic network is 10 consistent with the evolving needs of Canadian ethnic 11 communities, particularly in a digital world. We 12 believe that with the transition to digital, the 13 opportunity should be provided to each ethnic community 14 to develop a service which best suits its needs. Like 15 all Canadians, ethnic viewers want access to a variety 16 of programming in the language of choice, available at 17 times to suit their schedule. 18 469 A national multi-ethnic network would 19 not only fail to meet these needs, but would threaten 20 the developability of the Specialty services which do. 21 However, should the Commission see fit to licence such 22 a network, we believe its Condition of Licence must be 23 structured to protect existing Specialty service and to 24 ensure service to under-served communities. 25 470 In closing, Fairchild is proud of the StenoTran 120 1 service we provide to a wide variety of ethnic 2 communities. We believe the current policy framework 3 has contributed much to the development of distinctive 4 Canadian ethnic programming and that through this 5 policy review, we can work to further improve our 6 systems. 7 471 Thank you. 8 472 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 9 much. 10 473 I think that concludes this panel and 11 I just, once again, like to thank all of you for taking 12 the time to come in and sharing your views with us. 13 It's an important contribution to our deliberations and 14 we appreciate it very much. 15 474 I'd also just like to point out to 16 some of you who may have missed it, just given the 17 number of people that have asked to appear, we haven't 18 been able to ask questions of the presenters and it 19 doesn't reflect on our part a lack of interest, but 20 just a desire to hopefully get through the list and to 21 hear from you tonight before midnight. 22 475 And on that note, what we'd like to 23 do is break for half an hour to give everyone a chance 24 perhaps to get something to eat or a coffee or a bit of 25 a break and then I think we're probably going to have StenoTran 121 1 about another two and a half hours -- two to two and a 2 half hours following the break. So it is five to 7:00, 3 we'll be back here at 25 past. 4 476 Thank you. 5 1855 6 --- Recess / Pause 7 477 THE CHAIRPERSON: All right, Madame 8 Secretary, shall we begin with the next group of 9 presenters. 10 478 THE SECRETARY: If I can just make 11 sure that the following people are around the table: 12 Sheshi Assanand, Meena Paranjpe -- did I say that close 13 to right? 14 479 MS PARANJPE: You said that right. 15 480 THE SECRETARY: Thank you. John 16 Khuu. 17 481 MR. KHUU: Yes. 18 482 THE SECRETARY: Okay. Is there 19 anyone else in the room who wants to speak tonight? 20 483 MS PHAM: You haven't mentioned my 21 name. 22 484 THE SECRETARY: I'm sorry. 23 485 MS PHAM: Trinh Pham. 24 486 THE SECRETARY: Oh, yes, I'm sorry. 25 487 MS PHAM: It's okay. StenoTran 122 1 488 THE SECRETARY: Yes. Trinh Pham? 2 489 MS PHAM: Yes. 3 490 THE SECRETARY: Great. 4 491 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: (Off mic...) 5 492 THE SECRETARY: You're going to do 6 this together? You're going to present separately, are 7 you? 8 493 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Yes. 9 494 THE SECRETARY: Okay. 10 495 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: (Off mic...) 11 496 THE SECRETARY: You're negotiable, 12 aren't you? 13 --- Laughter / Rires 14 497 THE SECRETARY: Okay. Thank you very 15 much. We'll start with Sheshi Assanand. 16 1930 17 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 18 498 MS ASSANAND: I work for an 19 organization which is called Vancouver and Lower 20 Mainland Multicultural Family Support Services, I'm the 21 Executive Director of the organization. It's an 22 organization that works with immigrant and visible 23 minority women and children who experience family 24 violence. 25 499 One of my goal of being present here StenoTran 123 1 today is also to put the issue of women, especially 2 immigrant and visible minority women on the table and 3 the difficulties that they experience. Our whole area 4 of work is family violence. More recently, our 5 organization, together with People's Law School, which 6 is a publicly legal education body that provides 7 educational programs for the immigrant communities, as 8 well as others. We have received funding from Heritage 9 Canada and the funding is to provide a culturally 10 sensitive service, sort of culturally sensitive 11 programming for immigrant population on the issue of 12 wife abuse, child abuse and senior abuse, which really 13 requires us to use the services of the ethnic media. 14 500 And knowing that the ethnic media can 15 be -- or media by itself can be a very powerful tool to 16 reach out to the minority communities. This is also 17 with the idea that family violence is a tabooed subject 18 which is very seldom spoken of in minority cultures. 19 We find that our expertise and the knowledge of being 20 able to provide culturally sensitive services to 21 minority communities has prompted the funders to select 22 our services to reach out through the ethnic media. 23 501 What I'm going to talk about is the 24 technical difficulties that we have encountered in 25 trying to reach out to the communities through the StenoTran 124 1 ethnic media. 2 502 What we have discovered is that all 3 the producers are independent producers. There is very 4 little consistency in the way they provide programming. 5 Our ability to reach out to the community entirely 6 depends on the producer's interests in the issue, as I 7 said it's a tabooed issue, so there are people who are 8 not really interested in touching this particular 9 topic. 10 503 Secondly, we find that there is -- 11 they lack resources, so there isn't any consistency in 12 the resources that they have, which makes it very 13 difficult for them and organizations like ours. 14 504 The funding is limited, so there 15 isn't enough we can provide them, so really, it's 16 entirely dependent on what the producers can -- how 17 they can support us. And that's where the difficulty 18 lies. 19 505 I also want to compare -- this 20 project is a national project which means that Toronto 21 has it, the funding for it; Montreal has it and 22 Vancouver has it. 23 506 Unfortunately for us, Toronto seems 24 to have very easy access to ethnic media and to the 25 ethnic communities; Montreal and Vancouver seem to be StenoTran 125 1 having a lot of difficulties and again, as I said, 2 there is that inconsistency in the policy. What we 3 would like to see is that some kind of a policy that -- 4 and also I want to make a point that ethnic 5 organizations or, you know, multicultural organizations 6 have -- are able to provide culturally sensitive 7 approach in reaching out to the community and ethnic 8 media can also be a very powerful tool to break down 9 the taboos and so, we feel that a combination -- and 10 just by ourselves, it is very difficult to reach, 11 because they're not going to be taking an directives 12 from us. 13 507 That if there was a consistent policy 14 and support to them, I think it would make a lot of 15 difference in making sure -- I also want to mention 16 that one of the reasons is that if you're talking about 17 the issue of family violence, you find that immigrant 18 and visible minority women who don't work, that's the 19 group we want to reach. They're not going to read the 20 paper, they're not going to, sort of, watch mainstream 21 media in that sense and understand what's going on and 22 what is available to them. So through our reaching 23 out, it's something that we can be sure that they 24 listen to the radios or they listen to the TV and learn 25 what the issue of violence is all about and what they StenoTran 126 1 can do to remedy their situation. 2 508 So, keeping that in mind, and that's 3 just one example, but then there are other examples. 4 Earlier on Mobina talked about AIDS and, you know, 5 issues that are not openly talked about in our 6 communities. Parenting dilemmas are other very 7 difficult subjects that minority communities need to 8 deal with. 9 509 And to give you an example, very 10 recently what happened, we've been approaching ethnic 11 media and a Chinese multicultural channel said to us 12 that they are required by Rogers for us to prepare a 13 prototype tape for them to scrutinize. If they like 14 it, it will go on. Now, I want to say that it would be 15 very difficult for minimum resources that we have to 16 produce a prototype tape to be given out for them to 17 scrutinize and I think that that would really 18 jeopardize all the work that is being put in in this 19 particular project. This is just an example of one 20 particular project, but what I'm really seeking -- it's 21 an example, what I'm seeking is that more support for 22 the ethnic media and the community organizations to 23 work together, because the information that needs to be 24 provided to the communities can come from us, but 25 through the ethnic media, and that needs to be sort of StenoTran 127 1 taken into account. 2 510 So basically, I actually had not made 3 any formal presentation, because I wasn't sure whether 4 I would be able to attend this, sort of, hearing. But 5 I really would like to emphasize that women and 6 children from ethnic minority communities are at the 7 bottom of the ladder. And any kind of programming that 8 is happening for them needs to be taken into 9 consideration and family violence is one such example. 10 511 Thank you very much. 11 512 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 12 much. 13 513 THE SECRETARY: I finally caught on. 14 You two are together, aren't you? 15 514 MRS. PARANJPE: Yes. 16 515 THE SECRETARY: Okay. I would like 17 to invite Meena and Anand Paranjpe to make their 18 presentation now. 19 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 20 516 MRS. PARANJPE: By profession I'm a 21 Speech Pathologist, currently working as a Program 22 Manager in the South Fraser Region. 23 517 As a part of my job, not as a Speech 24 Pathologist, but as a Program Manager of the 25 department, I have been also in the -- member of the StenoTran 128 1 Regional Diversity Committee in South Fraser Region and 2 a Chairperson for Langley Community Health for 3 Diversity Committee. 4 518 Outside my job, I had worked as a 5 President for India Music Society, Director and 6 President both. I had been a member of Indo-Canadian 7 Community for over 31 years and I worked as my two-year 8 term in the B.C. Arts Council. 9 519 Based on all this experience, I'm 10 going to share some of my thoughts. 11 520 I find that in a pluralistic society, 12 there is a need for diversity of the program, diversity 13 of the cultures to be presented. Just recently, in 14 Langley Community Health, when we did the Diversity 15 Week, we presented some various programs and the basic 16 purpose was to create an opportunity for people to gain 17 exposure in the diversity we have in our country, in 18 the multicultural fabric of our country. And it was 19 very well received. 20 521 After every program when we gave 21 questionnaires, just to give you a rough idea about 150 22 questionnaires, there wasn't a single person who said 23 they didn't like this project or they didn't like this 24 idea. So people do want the opportunity to get some 25 exposure to diversity. Whether it is through StenoTran 129 1 educational projects, through lectures, even through 2 food or even media programs, performing arts, they like 3 it. 4 522 The analogy comes to my mind and we 5 use that in our region to explain our purpose was a 6 rainbow. It is very hard to say where red colour ends 7 and orange starts, for example, in a rainbow. It's 8 very cohesial. The same thing happens in the 9 community. There is -- it becomes a cohesial 10 community. Every ethnic community can keep their 11 identity and at the same time try to assimilate and 12 create a beautiful picture. 13 523 In my mind, a red colour alone or an 14 orange colour alone is beautiful, but the rainbow, 15 which is a cumulative effect of all the colours is even 16 more beautiful. And that's what my point is, if we 17 have the diversity in the programs, it's available, it 18 creates a more powerful, more effective effect and 19 that's what we want for a cohesial society. 20 524 Then the question comes, as if it is 21 done locally here, there are some plus points because 22 it's more approachable for us, it's easier for us to 23 explain our needs, needs of the community, needs of our 24 project, needs of the purposes of our projects and then 25 they're likely to respond to that. And that's the StenoTran 130 1 experience I had so far. 2 525 As a Speech Pathologist, when I 3 approached Rogers channel, they give a good exposure 4 because speech -- speech disorders or communication 5 problems are not limited to one particular community. 6 And when we wanted to make that appeal for people to 7 give information for people where to go, how to deal 8 with it, it was easy for us to deal with various 9 communities and community channels with Rogers, because 10 it was locally done. 11 526 So I would like to request that those 12 things continue. 13 527 Thank you. 14 528 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 15 much. 16 529 DR. PARANJPE: I'm Anand Paranjpe. 17 Like many, I wear, not just two, but many kinds of 18 hats. And the two kinds that I want to represent today 19 is one like my wife, Meena, she and I have been in 20 performing arts, basically in the projection and 21 promoting of performing arts of Indian background, 22 which I have been doing for a long time here, for about 23 25 years in this community and nationally as founder 24 and former Director of the Raga-Mala Performing Arts of 25 Canada, which received grants from various sources, and StenoTran 131 1 especially SSHRC several times for us to be able to go 2 across the country and hunt out the talent that, 3 regardless of their ethnic backgrounds have learned 4 performing arts of India. 5 530 And that is the kind of medium which 6 effectively reaches out to people of various kinds, 7 performing arts being one kind of medium. 8 531 The other kind of hat that I'm 9 talking about is myself as a Professor of Social 10 Psychology. And currently a member of the Metropolis 11 Research Project, which is basically a research project 12 here with a team recognized as a Centre for Excellence 13 in the Study of Immigration. And I have doctoral 14 students who have pursued doctoral studies in 15 psychology pertaining to especially youth problems in 16 growing up between cultures. 17 532 So that's the kind of background. In 18 addition, I have been also -- I have, for several 19 years, worked as a Director, one of the Directors of 20 the Shastri Indo-Canadian Institute, which promotes 21 cooperation between Indian and Canadian academics. So 22 I come from various angles at this. 23 533 In terms of the local situation of 24 the media in terms of the Rogers cable channel which 25 has been projecting out to the community at large, all StenoTran 132 1 the way from pop art or "Bollywood" movies, as they are 2 called, through to the presentation of classics of 3 Indian culture, such as the "Mahabharata", for 4 instance, the epic or its TV serialization, and let's 5 say, the epic "Ramayana" and its serialization in 6 contemporary forms, which reaches out not only to the 7 Indo-Canadian community, but to communities at large. 8 534 I wish to point out, for instance, 9 that there has been a presentation of "Ramayana", the 10 epic -- or rather, "Mahabharata", in international -- 11 with an international cast by Peter Brook. And these 12 kinds of ways of communicating the best of one culture 13 to other cultures through performing arts, I think 14 reaching out to a lot more people than we researchers 15 and the academia can. 16 535 And it is this value of sharing 17 culture and its values through these media that makes 18 it relevant. It's not simply that we can do that 19 nationally or from one central place as in Ontario; we 20 need local participation in it for, say, various 21 reasons. 22 536 Let me add this point in terms of the 23 media of my other hat, which is working with youth 24 issues as a psychologist. 25 537 Here in Vancouver, several years ago, StenoTran 133 1 rather, more than twice, we have used the local channel 2 to present to the community discussion or skits or 3 various forms of presenting contemporary issues of the 4 local community growing between cultures. 5 538 As an instance, the community is 6 facing a problem of second generation immigrants 7 getting married and Indian custom of arranged marriages 8 has become a flash point in the community's current 9 situation. I, as a psychologist, along with social 10 workers, presented, with the help of the community, a 11 series of programs to reach out to people to talk about 12 what the issues are like. 13 539 Such programming can be done not 14 simply nationally level, but it needs participation 15 from local persons, local community organizations and 16 local researchers. And this is an effective way of 17 helping community face its problems and find solutions 18 by coordinating all kinds of expertise together. 19 540 So these are the different kinds of 20 ways -- finally, one other important point that I wish 21 to suggest is that a country like Canada is going to 22 become culturally strong by keeping and promoting the 23 ancestral traditions. I'm very proud to say that the 24 university I belong to, Simon Fraser, has a bagpipe -- 25 Scottish bagpipe, that, for instance, beats out the StenoTran 134 1 local natives in their own land by going from here and 2 performing there. I feel proud about being that. 3 541 And similarly, I would like to 4 suggest that arts from all kinds of cultures should 5 grow here and how are we going to allow -- do that, 6 unless we have exposure to the community. We need not 7 centralize on this, we need to have local community 8 participation who have local identity problems. We 9 need to have integration rather than either 10 assimilation or separation and "ghettoization". And 11 the way of doing it is to share and to share the best 12 that any culture has to offer. And unless selected 13 aspects of different cultures become part of ourselves, 14 both our community level and our personal level, we are 15 not going to get... 16 542 And there are no -- no legislation 17 here. People can switch on probably any channel 18 randomly and they can find some Korean film or Chinese 19 dance presentation and fall in love. I wish to point 20 out that we have promoted, among other people, an 21 English person who is expert in "raagas" or a Japanese 22 Canadian person who presents "raagas" and we have been 23 looking for venues for presenting these artists who 24 actually assimilated the best of different cultures to 25 the public. StenoTran 135 1 543 And if we don't get these 2 opportunities, we are collectively impoverishing 3 ourselves, rather than enriching. We better do a good 4 use of the media. We would take pride in saying that 5 Canadians are among the top in communication media. 6 Let's use those communication media for the benefit of 7 all of us regardless of our backgrounds. 8 544 That's my submission, Madame and sir. 9 545 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 10 much, Dr. Paranjpe. 11 546 THE SECRETARY: Our next presenter is 12 John Khuu. 13 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 14 547 MR. KHUU: Good evening everyone. My 15 name is John and I'm currently enroling at BCIT. 16 548 Today I represent for CYS, which is 17 stand for Civil Youth Strategy Group. A group that's 18 pretty -- it's a pretty new group that provides service 19 for youths in the city. And I also represent for the 20 Vietnamese Youths Nationalist Community in B.C. 21 549 The reason for my presentation today 22 is to raise the voice of youth people regard to the 23 political thing like drugs and alcohol, gang, their 24 identity and their conflict that's happening 25 domestically or culturally. StenoTran 136 1 550 My presentation today is a 2 consultation for Question 2, which is: 3 "Given the demographic changes 4 that have taken place in Canada, 5 how can the needs and interests 6 of ethnocultural communities 7 continue to be served?" 8 551 First, I want to list four major 9 problems that's commonly happen to youth's people 10 nowadays. 11 552 The first one is drug and alcohol, as 12 I just said; the second is gang, and; the third is 13 their identity in the community; the fourth is conflict 14 with their family, like between youths and their 15 parents. 16 553 So in order to serve their needs and 17 interests in the right way, I would think that the 18 programming content in TV should focus more on those 19 problems. For example, having a program that's present 20 about the dangerous side of drugs, like the side 21 effect, socio-relation, et cetera. 22 554 Having a program that's present about 23 the gang issues in their community. Having a program 24 that's present about the youths' identity in the 25 community, like -- probably something like award StenoTran 137 1 recognition or community service for youths, et cetera. 2 And lastly is having a program that's present about the 3 solution for a problem that's relate in the conflict 4 which usually happen between youth people and their 5 parents. So from that, youth people have more chance 6 to raise their own voice to make their own voice 7 recognized to their parents and other people in their 8 community in general. 9 555 Thank you. 10 556 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 11 much. 12 557 THE SECRETARY: And next we have 13 Trinh Pham. 14 558 MS PHAM: Before addressing the 15 principle questions identified in the Public Notice, I 16 would like to introduce myself. My name is Trinh Pham, 17 I am a student at Simon Fraser University and the 18 University of British Columbia. And I'm here this 19 evening as one of the youth representatives for the 20 Vancouver Civic Youth Strategy Committee like John, and 21 also from the Vietnamese Youth Nationalist Community in 22 B.C. 23 559 The Vietnamese Canadian population in 24 the Lower Mainland is approximately 16,000. Although 25 we are not large in size, the community is devoted to StenoTran 138 1 establishing and fostering both Vietnamese and Canadian 2 traditional cultural values and beliefs. 3 560 The views I present here tonight come 4 from the concerns expressed at the Vietnamese community 5 over the past few years. And as a Canadian citizen and 6 a youth in the community, I believe that the matters 7 under consideration are extremely important, because as 8 demographic change, our priorities and cultural values 9 need to meet the needs of the people. So if these 10 issues weren't a concern for Canadians then public 11 consultations across the country are unnecessary like 12 the one tonight. 13 561 Moreover, the minority and especially 14 youth voices have been ignored or not taken seriously 15 lately. Therefore an emphasis is needed to reach out 16 and collect youth expressions and concerns. 17 562 The present broadcasting system has 18 "adequately" -- and I quote that -- served Canada's 19 ethnocultural communities in the recent years. These 20 services, however, are not -- are often dependent on 21 program availability and/or where programs are 22 purchased. Programs that have been aired on television 23 especially, have been brought mainly to our 24 neighbourhoods from the United States. 25 563 This issue is one of the main StenoTran 139 1 concerns of the Vietnamese community. It is a concern 2 because if the program is purchased from the States, it 3 will portray the cultures of the Americans instead of 4 the Canadians. News clips, for example, are relatively 5 appropriate since they reflect the current events 6 around the world. On the other hand, the programs, 7 they lack Canadian content and Canadian issues such as 8 cultural aspects, arts, performing arts, recent events 9 and community profile. In essence, we lose out on our 10 culture and the benefits to grow together as a mosaic 11 community. 12 564 In addition, the present broadcasting 13 system had failed to realize the needs of the 14 Vietnamese community. The majority of the Vietnamese 15 in Canada are political refugees, people who have left 16 Vietnam for political reasons, not economic. 17 Therefore, programs that are purchased overseas from 18 places such as Vietnam and shown on Canadian television 19 create a catastrophe, a domino effect you can say on 20 the Vietnamese community at large. 21 565 An excellent example of this was the 22 recent uproar seen and witnessed through a CNN news 23 broadcast report. This uprising was caused by programs 24 from Vietnam promoting the idea of communism and as 25 political refugees, here we share a common interest StenoTran 140 1 under the same political umbrella, we do not want 2 programs that are brought from Vietnam or other places 3 promoting the issues of communism to be aired on 4 Canadian television. 5 566 Issues such as this come near to the 6 heart of the Vietnamese community. In response, the 7 CRTC needs to pay closer attention to issues that the 8 ethnic community regards as repression, because silence 9 does not mean agreement. 10 567 Currently the multicultural channel 11 does not support us in a way is such that we believe 12 that the multicultural channel should not be privately 13 controlled by different groups, for example the 14 Vietnamese channel is controlled by privatization. 15 However, we believe that this responsibility control 16 should belong to the Board of Directors. These are the 17 people who are elected and nominated by the members of 18 the community. 19 568 In terms of radio access to 20 communities at large, it is limited. Why are we not 21 using our full radio band to full use and have 22 different communities have access to them? What are 23 the capabilities of setting up a radio station? What 24 are the steps? These are not expressed. 25 569 Radio airtime are often too expensive StenoTran 141 1 for community and often the radio station impose such 2 as advertising on each community. Within our own 3 community in the Vietnamese over the last year, we have 4 tried to buy airtime on 1320-AM, however over -- after 5 one year we were imposed that our own advertising could 6 not be used and only advertising from the station can 7 be used, therefore there is no funding coming back to 8 the community. As a result, we have been doing tapes 9 and issuing tapes for the community and asking for 10 donations for these tapes instead of having airtime. 11 570 So we would like to know where the 12 CRTC fits in to review individual programs if there is 13 such a policy; if not, we ask that one be created. 14 571 With regards to youth issues, the 15 current programs failed also to serve youths. How 16 often are youth positively portrayed on television or 17 radio? Not very often. 18 572 Speaking for a youth perspective, we 19 are voiceless in society because we do not have the 20 power or money, nor are we in a position to be noticed 21 for our position contribution. Only our negative 22 actions attract the camera and the microphone. 23 573 Television and radio program topics 24 have neglected to deal with issues that are important 25 to us. For instance, generation and cultural gaps in StenoTran 142 1 society, family values, role models, employment and 2 higher education. Moreover, the system has focused on 3 mainly ethnic youth, especially in the crime area. 4 574 I am often asked if I belong to a 5 gang because of my Vietnamese background, especially 6 after a program that has been focused on ethnic gang 7 crime or any negative aspects of youth. Whatever 8 happened to the positive side of youth? Doesn't anyone 9 care any more? I do care and the people in my 10 community do. 11 575 The negative portrayal of youths does 12 indeed lead youths into cultural pride loss and 13 uninterest in their own culture, and that is a shame 14 for loss for one's cultural heritage. 15 576 The needs and interests of the 16 ethnoculture in the Vietnamese community can continue 17 to be served by giving the voices ample opportunity to 18 become part of the mainstream voice. This can be 19 accomplished through regular consultations with the 20 ethnic community Boards of Director. For instance, 21 issues such as proper access to programming, station 22 programming view and et cetera. 23 577 Moreover, let the communities become 24 advisory boards to the CRTC when needed. For example, 25 the Public Notice tonight should have reached every StenoTran 143 1 community in advance. We did not receive this Notice 2 until last week, and more time was needed to prepare 3 and collect community input. 4 578 Also, have the program more widely 5 available, because those who can't afford cable will be 6 unable to view such programs. There also needs to be 7 sub-titles, closed captioning for viewers who wish to 8 view programs in other language or culture. 9 579 And yes, there should definitely be a 10 priority on development of Canadian ethnocultural 11 services, rather than importing foreign services. The 12 Vietnamese community supports this idea because first, 13 it will provide jobs for Canadians and taxpayers' 14 dollars should remain in the country. Second, it will 15 allow for the incorporation of our cultural activities 16 within our cultural realm. Third, if these 17 Canadian-made programs are successful and desired by 18 other countries, we are not only bringing revenues into 19 the country, but also allowing our broadcasting 20 industry to competently grow. Fourth, by investing in 21 local programming, Canadian values and mosaic 22 commitments to the ethnocultural communities will be 23 recognized and better received by Canadians. 24 580 In summary, the CRTC, in what we 25 believe to be need to express that the voices and StenoTran 144 1 provide them with the opportunity to become part of the 2 existing voice. The issues of youth, especially youth 3 of ethnic background are issues which are important to 4 them. Allow the ethnic community Boards of Directors 5 to assist in ethnic issues such as an advisory board. 6 Have more Canadian content through the development of 7 Canadian ethnocultural services rather than importing 8 foreign services. 9 581 And lastly, be cautious of programs 10 brought from other countries as not to offend a 11 community that the programs purchased from Vietnam 12 promoting communism. 13 582 Thank you. 14 583 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 15 much. 16 584 THE SECRETARY: Our next presenter is 17 David Ali. 18 2000 19 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 20 585 MR. ALI: Members of the Commission, 21 my name is David Ali. I'm a Canadian citizen, 22 originally from Fiji. I lived in the United Kingdom 23 for nine years before immigrating to Canada. I'm an 24 Engineer with BC Tel. I'm also a Secretary for B.C. 25 Muslim Association in one of the branches. StenoTran 145 1 586 I appreciate this opportunity to 2 appear before you today to present my view on the CRTC 3 Ethnic Broadcasting Policy. 4 587 I would like to see sources made 5 available to the Islamic value program through the 6 Canadian ethnic broadcasting services. Instead of 7 importing programs from overseas, it would be better if 8 these programs could be assembled here and people 9 voluntary or hired for the job. 10 588 Most of the Canadian programs that 11 are available here, which are shown on the mainstream 12 of the TV are probably early in the morning at six 13 o'clock or 7:00 in the morning when people are sleeping 14 or late at night at one o'clock or two o'clock, and 15 most of the younger generation are not watching the TV 16 at that time of the day. 17 589 I would like to see some of these 18 programs at the -- earlier on at maybe six o'clock in 19 the evening or, you know, whatever the time is 20 suitable. 21 590 Actually, Rogers is doing a pretty 22 good job of bringing all the ethnic together, but they 23 still neglect all the Islamic programs to some extent. 24 This could only be achieved by bringing the mainstream 25 TV broadcasting service and then providing this service StenoTran 146 1 to the community. 2 591 I would think the youth will 3 appreciate that and at the same time, it will be a 4 service to the youth who are coming up into this 5 country where things are a little different than at 6 home. 7 592 I would also like to point out the 8 misconcept people have, because they have no idea why 9 our women dress up the way they do, why the older 10 generation behaves the way they do. The only way to 11 take this misconcept out of the system is to have some 12 sort of media which will channel this thing to the 13 people. 14 593 I appreciate this opportunity to 15 express my view, and thank you very much. 16 594 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you very 17 much. 18 595 I think -- Madame Secretary...? 19 596 THE SECRETARY: Is there anyone else 20 in the room who has not presented that wants to 21 present? 22 597 Could I have your name, please? 23 --- No response / Pas de reponse 24 598 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: I actually am 25 here on behalf of a friend who couldn't make it, so she StenoTran 147 1 wants -- she has a letter here that she would like me 2 to read out for her. 3 599 THE SECRETARY: Okay. 4 600 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Is that okay? 5 601 THE SECRETARY: What's your friend's 6 name? 7 602 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Her name is 8 Nancy Li, that's L-i. 9 603 THE SECRETARY: Okay. 10 604 UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: And I've got 11 copies of the letter that I can give you later or now. 12 605 THE SECRETARY: Mm-hmm. Go ahead, 13 please. 14 PRESENTATION / PRÉSENTATION 15 606 W. YOUNG: Her letter states, and 16 these are her views, obviously: 17 607 My name is Nancy Li. I am a regular 18 listener, audience and consumer of the Chinese media. 19 The concerns I have today relate particularly to the 20 Chinese Pay television. 21 608 I believe the role of an ethnic 22 language media in a multicultural society plays an 23 equally important role as the mainstream media in 24 informing its viewers. Given that our mainstream media 25 is monolingual and monocultural, ethnic media plays a StenoTran 148 1 much greater role in terms of integrating its viewers 2 into the society at large. 3 609 For many in the Chinese community, 4 China's language television is their only source of 5 information of the society they live in and of the 6 outside world. They rely on the television for news, 7 community issues and information of the society. Many 8 bilingual Chinese/English in the community also find it 9 easier to understand the news in their mother tongue. 10 610 One only has to compare the number of 11 Chinese language newspapers, hours of radio broadcast 12 and the viewership of Chinese Pay television with the 13 number of Chinese population to understand the hunger 14 for news and information within the Chinese community. 15 This should help you understand -- excuse me. 16 611 This should help you understand the 17 power of the Chinese language media that has over this 18 community. The need to inform the Chinese public of 19 the local events, news and culture is event. However, 20 I must say that this need has not been met. It seems 21 to me that the Chinese Paid television has been relying 22 very heavily on Hong Kong and Taiwan imports. 23 612 The day program time is filled up by 24 reruns of the same soap opera of the night before, 25 followed by other decade-old soaps. The evening prime StenoTran 149 1 time differs by one news program and one local 2 production which includes reruns of old W-5 episodes. 3 The rest of the evening is taken up by soap operas that 4 rehash themes of dysfunctional family disputes and 5 crime dramas. 6 613 If we were to believe that television 7 has any impact on the behaviour of the audience, 8 especially those of young viewers, then I would have to 9 say that the current Chinese television programs are 10 influencing viewers in a very negative way and doing 11 very little to inform or integrate the viewers with 12 their local lives. 13 614 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you. 14 615 THE SECRETARY: I believe that's all 15 the presenters we have here at this time. 16 616 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you. I'd 17 just like to thank the panel for taking the time to 18 come and share your views with us. It's very important 19 as we do our deliberations that we hear from people 20 across the country and I very much appreciate it and so 21 does my colleague. 22 617 Thank you very much for coming. 23 618 So I think we'll take a 10 minute 24 break. 25 --- Recess / Pause StenoTran 150 1 619 THE CHAIRPERSON: It doesn't appear 2 we have any more presenters for today and I believe 3 that concludes the presentations for this evening. 4 Have you anything to add? 5 620 THE SECRETARY: Nothing at this time. 6 621 THE CHAIRPERSON: Thank you and thank 7 you everybody for being here and we will reconvene 8 tomorrow at 4:00 p.m. 9 --- Whereupon the hearing adjourned at 2018 / 10 L'audience est ajournée à 2018 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25
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